A carb on the Beta is a plus in my book. One less thing (fuel pump) to break on a trail. Yamaha's are hard to kill for sure. I have had a couple and currently have one and am a happy customer.
What you say has truth but:; But i say; what are you going to do when your job is sent over to China for 9$ an hr.?? The purchase is not complicated at all , Gas Gas wants the tech and i would presume they will advance on it. Americans take themselves way to seriously.
I'm not privy to the details of this deal, but I would think that GasGas and Pierer had a conversation about what was included in the deal and what wasn't, as far as tooling, manufacturing rights, facilities, etc. I highly doubt that GasGas bought a bunch of technology and has no idea how they are going to have the parts made. Exactly what the deal was, we'll all probably never know, but it probably works for both parties since they agreed to it. There's also no reason to think that the parts wouldn't be interchangeable because they are made on different molds. Aftermarket replacement parts (for cars and bikes) are very common, and people frequently use everything from plastics to pistons that were not made on the OEM molds without problem. With regard to all the brand loyalty BS, you can find horror stories and success stories about any brand. We have plenty of people here who love their bikes, and some who think they are garbage. There's no need to argue about it and/or bash Husky or any other brand.
They are doing better than they used to but they are still not as good as the older forward engines. So decide which is better.
Yep, they sure suck ... just look at the GNCC results this year. Second and third in Florida; second, third, and fourth in Georgia. Np doubt Scott Summers could have whooped them on an old air-cooled XR
If someone keeps digging at it long enough, sure, some decade it will all work and at the price they choose to make you pay ... Air forks will be here for sure someday after they were invented (?) in the 70s? Look at all that old technology bmw brought back on the 449 bikes ... it worked...worked so well they sold the brand of bikes they put it on ...
Its EZ to poke fun at something you don't know anything about. I have owned a 511 since they first came out and it a great bike with lots of newer tech other manufactures were scared to venture off and try, they would rather just build another CRF copy or put new graphics on the same bike. I actually appreciate they had the balls to try new stuff instead of follow the lemmings as thats how advancements are made. The air filter stays WAY cleaner for WAY longer then a conventional design that sits low and by a tire churning up dirt and dust all day. It also placed the light weight part high (airbox and the heavy stuff low and centralized (the gas). I feel invincible in water crossings. I can feel the mass centralization and it makes the bike feel lighter while riding. The CTS is the real deal and loved by almost everyone that actually owns one. The traction is amazing, my chain and sprockets live WAY longer than conventional ones as it is not whipping around and being tugged on with every bump. Also makes checking and greasing the swingarm bearing super simple 10 minute job. The top mounted linkage with zerks has needed nothing in over 5000 miles as it is not being thrashed in the mud and dirt, being smashed into by every log and rock I cross and allows me to get over logs without snagging low hanging linkages and I don't need to buy a $330 aftermarket linkage guard to "fix" it. The EFI is very good, the E-start has been flawless (very unlike the 250-310), the motor is very reliable, things the 250-310 struggle with. Bash all you want but people that actually own 449/511's seem to love them and have very little issues with them which is proven buy the utter lack of "help me " threads unlike the endless threads for the 250-310 bikes. There are two issues with these bikes, lean flame outs due to EPA mapping ($40 fix for many) and the also EPA induced oil in the airbox which I fixed with a $2 hunk of hose. The 511 has been one of the most solid bikes I have ever owned and even after thrashing it for over 5000 off road miles it is still solid and new feeling and will remain in my stable for many years to come which is not the norm for me. I'm not scared of advancements, bring it on. Its people posting about things they know nothing about that kills good things not the tech itself.
Kelley is so right on about the 449/511 platform. My 449 has been a solid low maintenance workhorse that I feel lacks nothing in performance to any bike I have sampled. I rode a 14 Beta 300 this weekend and thought my 449 felt lighter and handled better and this was in super tight single track.
First, I never said the bike did not work or that it did not perform as expected...I'm the guy that always points to that bike winning a SM championship in EU .. I'm actually a Husqvarna rider. Not the guy who has 5 different bikes. I have 5 different Husky bikes, right now in my home. I have your bike and I fixed the starting on it!! I'm on Husqvarnas' side. I want Husky to succeed. I wanted Juhn to win that 9th(?) world title on the bike... I did not wanna see him break his ankle or what ever happen with him that final(?) yr the bike was raced on that scale ... I'm also the guy who points out the bike's only win was with the replacement rider and in a mud race ... That race cemented the fact to me that that bike must get better traction than a traditional bike. Owners comments after they purchased added to this ... -- I said bmw made all that old stuff from yrs back work on the bike and then bmw sold it. Sorry, but that is what happened ...I don't see why some other brand does not keep all that stuff bmw spent money on going but who knows? -- MZ, would you please use paragraphs when writing those long drawn out replies .. I do know some about the English language and that style of writing, without paragraphs, is grade school stuff and is hard for old adults like me to read. Your content is good, but work on the delivery please ...
Is gas gas to aquire the 449/511 platform rights or is this thread gone off from the title here? Title then text copied from the link in post #1 "KTM sells off ‘Italian’ Husqvarna engine technology The company Moto Italia srl, former Husqvarna Motorcycles srl and today owned by Pierer Industrie, have sold the two-stroke and four-stroke engine technology used in the Husqvarna machines that were built and developed in Italy under BMW ownership to Gas Gas. " I would need a clarification what old stuff from year back do you speak of. The engine at least the head was derived from formula 1 automotive efforts. Surely the fuel injection isn't from years back. BMW sent me a post card with a picture of the first one, I called up and the price for the one they had just because of the shock absorber got a $700 bump and there were other bumps. It had a 3 year warranty. Undoubtedly some improvements were made with the husky badged ones, the silly stuff of expensive pieces on the for sale models above the base model stopped. But the warrany went down to 6 months. The transmission got another speed but closer ratio overall. Believe what you want about the trouble free statements in post 131 above I could have bought one for reasonable cost but dedided not to.
Not sure on who owns what on these bikes ... Seems there are many different angles of bikes being built around the world that seem to be clones of the ITL Huskies ... Some of it seems to point to bmw selling off the goods ... Some looks like SP(?) doing it as well as stated on this thread. -- You gotta expect bmw to do something different with bikes such as the head work, efi, fuel tank location ... It's just what bmw does daily with anything it produces. The CTS stuff has been tried in the past to some degree of success in a few different ways ... Probably works well in some cases but other cases, like jumping the bike, it might not be what PRO riders in MX want ... For non-CTS bikes, you could even buy a chain slider that tries to move the angle of the chain pulling on the SA by add a big bump right in front of the FS in order to help bikes in the same manner as a true CTS setup... The idea is probably good but who other than bmw wants to engineer all that again? The clutch is on the crank or some odd place as compared to other bikes ... Seems bmw fixed it but I'm not sure how that works... The engine spins backwards ( I think) ... Not sure how old that is and others have used that to some degree of success ... I don't remember alot being written on this subject. Someone correct me if this is incorrect ... Those top 2 items were the attention getters.. Seems like there was another item with the bikes but I'm drawing a blank ... This was all made to work on the bikes. And then bmw sold the brand. Where is that technology today? Not sure but it should pop up somewhere ... -- There is only so much that can be written on a subject before it goes off somewhere else ...
Ok I see cts being equated to the things some guys do to their hillclimb bikes so as to overcome chasis jacking or the common ATK comparison. I have heard stories of adding a roller above and below the swingarm pretty close to the pivot the chain doesn't go slack and tight like normal apparently one way to do it. As for the clutch being on the crank it resulted in no damping being able to be incorporated into the design. That I do see as being "old" still have all the old problems associated. Fran
As amusing as ray and fran are on this topic, I hate to kill the exchange of 3rd and knowledge, but I believe BMW kept the 449/511 engine design and have licensed/ sold motors to CCM. The same was true of the 650 and 900 designs. Any future production of these by KTM or anyone else would result in fees being paid to BMW.
no. they're also seeling to speedbrain. they even sell engines separately (at a quite low price, if you ask me). r
Or just an opinion. Russ is a good guy and he really likes his 449, it fits him well and works great for him. I'm not going to argue with that. the Beta 300 I rode felt kinda bulky to me, all 300's kinda do to me but I was stepping off a 09 WR144 to everything feels bigger. Thats said the Beta felt lighter than my 511. To me. Russ is welcome to his opinion. I think you posted once that the Beta felt lighter than a husky 125 which I don't agree with but thats your reference point and I'll not call you names over it.
