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Hi everyone,
As you all know, Coffee (Dean) passed away a couple of years ago. I am Dean's ex-wife's husband and happen to have spent my career in tech. Over the years, I occasionally helped Dean with various tech issues.
When he passed, I worked with his kids to gather the necessary credentials to keep this site running. Since then (and for however long they worked with Coffee), Woodschick and Dirtdame have been maintaining the site and covering the costs. Without their hard work and financial support, CafeHusky would have been lost.
Over the past couple of weeks, I’ve been working to migrate the site to a free cloud compute instance so that Woodschick and Dirtdame no longer have to fund it. At the same time, I’ve updated the site to a current version of XenForo (the discussion software it runs on). The previous version was outdated and no longer supported.
Unfortunately, the new software version doesn’t support importing the old site’s styles, so for now, you’ll see the XenForo default style. This may change over time.
Coffee didn’t document the work he did on the site, so I’ve been digging through the old setup to understand how everything was running. There may still be things I’ve missed. One known issue is that email functionality is not yet working on the new site, but I hope to resolve this over time.
Thanks for your patience and support!
250-500cc Tell me about the CR ignition on your WR250/300
- Thread starter K5PL5
- Start date
Not on with the Ducati electronics. The CDI/Coil is a single unit. Up until those switched (2011?), the same coil could be used.
Kyle Tarry
Husqvarna
Pro Class
It looks like this question never got answered. Can someone take a crack at it? Is 2002 the only model year that works, or are there others? If it's the only year, what are the differences that make this the case?
I'm interested in trying something on my WR, but it is a requirement that I be able to retain my lights. If you guys can get me started, I would not mind looking into this. I also have access to machine tools so I can make changes if required...
Those will all work, just make sure the CDI matches the stator and flywheel. The '02 is supposed to be the best performance-wise though.
Kyle Tarry
Husqvarna
Pro Class
I see, so the reason guys are recommending the 2002 is for performance, not parts compatibility. How significant are the differences between, say a CR 2002 and 2004, relative to the difference between the CR and the WR?
Of course, this is all probably moot for me, since I need the lighting coil.
I wonder what the variable is here that is effecting the performance; it sounds like it might not be the curves, makes me wonder if it's a spark energy thing? There are definitely ways to measure that (I have no clue how to do it, but aftermarket ignition guys do), would be interesting...
Of course, this is all probably moot for me, since I need the lighting coil.
I wonder what the variable is here that is effecting the performance; it sounds like it might not be the curves, makes me wonder if it's a spark energy thing? There are definitely ways to measure that (I have no clue how to do it, but aftermarket ignition guys do), would be interesting...
MOTORHEAD
Husqvarna
Pro Class
I know nothing of the CR250 past '02. Was there even a CR250 made past 2002? I don't think there was one imported into the states past 2002.
I had an '01 ignition, that is what my current stator is, and it's better than a WR ignition, but the '02 is the best I've found.
The spark energy is better on any of the CR units than it is with the WR's. You can look through threads on here and find many that have questioned if they have an ignition issue just from the weak looking spark the WR puts out. All the CR unit put out a much better spark than the WR, so there is some performance gain there. But, as I've stated before, the '02 has a much longer trigger so you can create a wider retard and advance curve than you can with the '01 flywheel. The '01 flywheel won't work with the '02 DCDI box because the short trigger freaks the timing out. It will run, and it will show good timing at idle, but as soon as the RPM increase, it actually starts to retard, and it should be jumping to the highest advance point just after idle.
So, you get better spark energy from the earlier units, but not the better advance curve.
I've been doing a lot of studying, trying to find a unit that could easily adapted from another brand. ( I'm not sure why because I have one that's working fine. ) I even bought a KTM flywheel to see how close it was, but everything seems to have a different crank tapper. The KTM unit I got had the right trigger length and was a great match, but the tapper was wrong. The stator windings are right and it could be bolted to a CR backing plate, just like the CR125 guys are doing for lighting coils, but where do you get a CR backing plate?
I'm probable going to invest in a KTM lighting stator from Trail Tech and try and do the lighting coil conversion, so I'll try getting one that come with a backing plate to see how close it is to bolting up to the Husky cases.
Most all the current 250's out there run a 72mm stroke and a 125mm rod, with very close port timing, so their CDI units should work very well with the Husky. Especially the non TPS units, like most of the KTM.
If someone knows of a brand that uses the same crank end tapper as the Husky, then let me know.
I had an '01 ignition, that is what my current stator is, and it's better than a WR ignition, but the '02 is the best I've found.
The spark energy is better on any of the CR units than it is with the WR's. You can look through threads on here and find many that have questioned if they have an ignition issue just from the weak looking spark the WR puts out. All the CR unit put out a much better spark than the WR, so there is some performance gain there. But, as I've stated before, the '02 has a much longer trigger so you can create a wider retard and advance curve than you can with the '01 flywheel. The '01 flywheel won't work with the '02 DCDI box because the short trigger freaks the timing out. It will run, and it will show good timing at idle, but as soon as the RPM increase, it actually starts to retard, and it should be jumping to the highest advance point just after idle.
So, you get better spark energy from the earlier units, but not the better advance curve.
I've been doing a lot of studying, trying to find a unit that could easily adapted from another brand. ( I'm not sure why because I have one that's working fine. ) I even bought a KTM flywheel to see how close it was, but everything seems to have a different crank tapper. The KTM unit I got had the right trigger length and was a great match, but the tapper was wrong. The stator windings are right and it could be bolted to a CR backing plate, just like the CR125 guys are doing for lighting coils, but where do you get a CR backing plate?
I'm probable going to invest in a KTM lighting stator from Trail Tech and try and do the lighting coil conversion, so I'll try getting one that come with a backing plate to see how close it is to bolting up to the Husky cases.
Most all the current 250's out there run a 72mm stroke and a 125mm rod, with very close port timing, so their CDI units should work very well with the Husky. Especially the non TPS units, like most of the KTM.
If someone knows of a brand that uses the same crank end tapper as the Husky, then let me know.
Whats the possibility a good lathe operator could fix the tapper for you? How far off is it?
I doubt it will help much, but the PVL unit for the Husky is the same as the Hodaka ;-) the PVL does not use a woodruff key though, so the taper would be the only thing being checked.
I can check the part number when I get home, then using this page we can get the measurements for the taper:
http://www.pvl-zuendungen.de/cms-en/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=73&Itemid=74
The fact that it rotates the opposite direction, has me thinking the largest problem will be getting it to fire where it should before TDC rather than after.
Kyle Tarry
Husqvarna
Pro Class
Check this out: According to HPI, the 2008 WR300 has the same flywheel taper as early 90's KTM 250MX and '09+ 65SX. Not sure if this helps.
http://www.hpi.be/applistlist.php?writeimg=068R038&select=068&clr=c
Sadly, they don't list any of the dimensions for the other KTMs.
I wonder what part of the WR ignition sucks so bad (ie, is it the stator/flywheel, or the CDI box). Does anyone have the workshop manual for a 2002 CR and a 2012 WR?
http://www.hpi.be/applistlist.php?writeimg=068R038&select=068&clr=c
Sadly, they don't list any of the dimensions for the other KTMs.
I wonder what part of the WR ignition sucks so bad (ie, is it the stator/flywheel, or the CDI box). Does anyone have the workshop manual for a 2002 CR and a 2012 WR?
MOTORHEAD
Husqvarna
Pro Class
That's good info.
A Honda CR250 has the same angle of taper, but it's much shorter, so the end is bigger diameter.
I'm not sure which part is the real problem. I know it's not the coil, because I'm using the same coil. The stator on the WR only uses one winding for the ignition system and the other three are for the lighting coil. The box is about the same as a Honda Z50's.
I could build a unit using an MSD Single Cylinder Programmable Ignition box, but you would have to have a battery and a reg/ rec to convert the lighting coils to DC and keep the battery charged. Then just build your own timing map.
A Honda CR250 has the same angle of taper, but it's much shorter, so the end is bigger diameter.
I'm not sure which part is the real problem. I know it's not the coil, because I'm using the same coil. The stator on the WR only uses one winding for the ignition system and the other three are for the lighting coil. The box is about the same as a Honda Z50's.
I could build a unit using an MSD Single Cylinder Programmable Ignition box, but you would have to have a battery and a reg/ rec to convert the lighting coils to DC and keep the battery charged. Then just build your own timing map.
Shop manuals:
2011 (same as the 2012)
2001 (they don't have a 2002 listed)
That'd be interesting if a 65SX worked...talk about zero flywheel effect...
2011 (same as the 2012)
2001 (they don't have a 2002 listed)
That'd be interesting if a 65SX worked...talk about zero flywheel effect...
Kyle Tarry
Husqvarna
Pro Class
2012+ bikes with the Ducati ignition already are DC... The lights and the ignition all run on the same circuit (same power feed); I don't know how the stator is wound. The service manual might say, if not I will pop my cover off and look.
Actually, msmith, you have a '12, right? Can you take a look at how the stator is wound, or snap us a photo?
I assume the battery is required because the MSD box won't fire up on a kick?
Of course, if the weakness is in the stator windings, this MSD business is all moot.
MSmith, that link for the 2012 doesn't work. Well, it works, but it just goes to a 1-page document that says "look at the 2011 manual, everything is the same." Which is true, except for the tiny bit we care about.
Yeah, I've got it setting in the garage at home. I'll snap a picture tonight. I don't believe that it is accurate that the WR runs DC. There is a regulator, but no rectifier in the system. I'm 99% sure the lights are AC, as pretty much all dirt bikes without an electric start are.
Fixed in the post above, I forgot they had that on there, I didn't look at it when I posted the link.MSmith, that link for the 2012 doesn't work. Well, it works, but it just goes to a 1-page document that says "look at the 2011 manual, everything is the same." Which is true, except for the tiny bit we care about.
I believe you are correct.