250-500cc Tell me about the CR ignition on your WR250/300

[MOTORHEAD]

shawbagga, To run a 2002 ignition box or JD box you need the stator and flywheel.


2premo, not patting self.

For "ME", the 2002 ignition and JD box with the flywheel weight of the WR would be perfect.

Yes, I have considered an ignition system from another brand of bike. There is another thread where I talked about.

 

[2premo]

shawbagga, To run a 2002 ignition box or JD box you need the stator and flywheel.


2premo, not patting self.

For "ME", the 2002 ignition and JD box with the flywheel weight of the WR would be perfect.

Yes, I have considered an ignition system from another brand of bike. There is another thread where I talked about.

not patting was meant in humor

 

[2premo]

shawbagga, To run a 2002 ignition box or JD box you need the stator and flywheel.


2premo, not patting self.

For "ME", the 2002 ignition and JD box with the flywheel weight of the WR would be perfect.

Yes, I have considered an ignition system from another brand of bike. There is another thread where I talked about.

so you tried one?
did it work?
do you remember the thread?

 

[shawbagga]

just got too hard for me!

 

[MOTORHEAD]

I have looked into it, but have not found anything that looks very easy. A 2004 KX250 looked like the best possibility to me, but it would still be a lot of work, and I'm not sure about changing rotation of the flywheel.

 

[wait4me]

Has anyone tried to advance the ign timing for a lil more pep?

 

[MOTORHEAD]

You mean on the WR ignition I assume. According to the shop manual, the CR and WR have very similar advance curves, with the exception of the CR been digital and the WR analog, so I don't think that would really do much.



As far as looking into another ignition that might work, I did a lot of studying on the matter and the KTM units from around 2000 on up look like very good possibilities for a swap. The SX stators and flywheels, with exception of the backing plate and the way the hub is mounted, are pretty much the same as the 2002 CR250.

The KTM EXC versions have very similar stators, but with lighting coils. The flywheels are basically the same, with the longer '02 CR digital trigger point, but the hub is mounted outboard of the wheel. Where as the CR is inboard. Also, the trigger point is about 120 degrees off from the CR, probable due to the opposing rotations.

The neat thing about the KTM EXC units is that they have big flywheel weights already mounted on them. So lighting coils and heavier weights would be a plus.

The other up side in that since they both run 66 X 72 strokes and 125mm rods, the KTM ECU or CDI, which ever you prefer, should work just fine on WR. Or, if the JD racing units were easily had, you can switch the harness plug over to use it.

The kickers come down to the center hub and the backing plate. A backing plate shouldn't be a big issue, but the hub might be. If the bore has the same taper and diameter as a CR, then it would be a matter of just cutting a new key way to match up with the CR's. If not, it would take a little more work.

The good news is that for those of us who already have an '02 CR unit is that we might be able to swap stator coils with an EXC and get lighting, with out a huge amount of work. Very similar to what the guys with CR125's are doing with the KTM coils to get lights. It looks like the very same KTM replacement unit they are using would do the trick for us, too. So, it's just a matter of following their lead with the '02 CR250 unit.

Disclaimer time; This is all from looking at pictures and comparing known dimensions. I don't have the KTM parts in hand.

 

[doc187]

When I bought my 02 cr250 the guy told me it was stock except a weighted flywheel. Does that mean he swapped the wr flywheel but I still have the cr ignition, or would he have swapped both?

 

[rockdancer]

id say it has a weight on the CR flywheel - you can see it if you take cover off .

 

[MOTORHEAD]

Yes, I'm sure it has an add on weight. The WR flywheel won't fit with the CR stator.

I did get a flywheel from a '97 KTM 300 for ebay the other day. It's pretty much the same as the CR unit, except the tapper in the bore is a little wrong and the key way is off.

 

[454x]

What do you mean the key way is off?

 

[MOTORHEAD]

I mean the key way is cut at a much different degree in the relationship to the trigger. You would have a big issue with getting the timing dialed in, and may require modified backing plate, or recutting the key way.

 

[msmith345]

the CR 250 and 360 shared ignitions

What years are you seeing this? All that I have checked have 3 separate stator/flywheel/cdi, one for the CR, then one for each the WR 250 and 360.

By the way, if one of you do swap out for a CR ignition soon, hit me up if you want to recoup some of the cost and get rid of your WR ignition. Mine's dead, and ditching the Ducati kit doesn't sound like a bad idea.

 

[2premo]

if you look at the years they had a CR 360 and look at the 250 you will see what I mean, as an FYI the 92 is a bastard because original ignition was Motoplat so it uses a different crank stub, the rest of the WR 360's to 2002 shared a common ignition and also the years that had a CR model used a common crank, and as the 250 and 360 CR models used the same ignition
so by deduction the ignition will work

 

[MOTORHEAD]

I agree. From what I have seen they are the same ignition.

 

[juicypips]

your cr ignition is dead? ive got a complete working wr ignition if you want to trade msmith345

 

[msmith345]

your cr ignition is dead? ive got a complete working wr ignition if you want to trade msmith345

Nope, mine that died is the 2012 WR stock setup. I don't know where the failure is in it, stator/flywheel or the coil/cdi side. Not sure how I could test that either.

I'm going to have to take a look at the 360 setup this weekend. Still iffy on actually trying to run it in the 250, but I'm going to at least compare the two. The 360 does have a PVL setup in it, and checking their parts listing there would be two different models: "93-Current 125-250cc" and "All models 360cc - Open", not sure if either would be recommended, but I can always find the part numbers on the one in the 360 and send an inquiry over their way.

That is unless someone either points me in the direction for a CR one or has their unused WR one that they want to part with.

 

[2premo]

The 92 360 uses a bastard ignition compared to 93 on

 

[msmith345]

The 92 360 uses a bastard ignition compared to 93 on

True. I got a bit more info from Penton. I missed that the '92 does infact use a different part number than the '93+ models. So, I won't be swapping it to the 250, more likely I will be going the PVL route though and going with the 70049 model which is for the 93+ 125-250cc bikes. The only difference between that and the open class kit is that the open class kit has 5000 wind stator vs the 4000 wind stator, which is supposed to make starting easier (this could be why I start my 360 in sandals, one kick, without a decompression head).

The PVL setup will have less flywheel effect than the WR and has no lighting coil. It's supposed to be a "performance" replacement, but I haven't seen any direct comparison to something like an OEM CR. It isn't a bolt on and go swap, like the CR, but I can't help thinking that it may be a reasonable (and more importantly available) alternative.

 

[MOTORHEAD]

I've looked at these and several other systems out there for possible use on the WR's. I'd love to see someone try one with good results. I'm a very strong believer that the stock WR system is holding these bikes back.