Spot Personal Tracker and GPS

[Ignaciob]

My problem with them is leaving them on all day riding, crashing at the end of the day then find out the battery is kaput.
Better than nothing.

You mean the little flashing light that tells you its time to change the battery and then you still have 24-48 hours of continuous operation before it actually goes kaput? Doesn't seem an issue to me....or at least for the SPOT unit I have.

Not "could leave less question", it does. Its on the frequencies that the military run and monitor, Spot is on Motorola's consumer paid satellites. I'm in the rescue business and the Spots do work, accurate? that's another topic but accurate enough.

That certainly helps. However, I'd still like to see some empirical documentation to support your claim.

 

[Abby]

we use the spots all the time and dont have any issues. we have the epirb things on the boat that goes over to another island.

this looks like a contest to see who has the biggest, but it doesn't matter to the user.

 

[HuskyDude]

I was told by the communication company that supplies our school district maintenance vehicles and buses with radios and such, that the EPIRB was more accurate than Spot by far, but at a substantial cost difference. $100 for the unit $100 annual fees for the SPOT compared to ???
Does anyone know the cost of the EPIRB
Also something about the SPOT satellite get less actuate the further North you are.
Just what I heard.
Doesn't look like CoderRider is having any issues with his. How much further North do you want to go...

 

[Ignaciob]

$100 for the unit $100 annual fees for the SPOT compared to ???

Also something about the SPOT satellite get less actuate the further North you are.
Just what I heard.
Doesn't look like CoderRider is having any issues with his. How much further North do you want to go...

You can pick up SPOT 1 units for $10-$40 these days on fleabay. SPOT 2 will probably cheapen up as the SPOT 3 units are released in the near future. Basic SPOT service is about $100 a year, but the $150 option is the one to get if you want to do the tracking feature without pressing the button perpetually.

SPOT coverage is virtually all of North America and most of the land masses in the world. Certainly if you ride your Terra to Hawaii....it's probably not going to work the whole ride...and certainly finding floating fueling stations are going to be a bigger issue while you're on plane.

It's 99%+ probability of sending a single message within 20 minutes and SPOT keeps trying as long as a 911 button is pressed...or until batteries run out. I could imagine pinpoint accuracy diminishing from what are probably are geostationary satellites along the equator or on edges of coverage (e.g. north slope of Alaska). If the EPIRBs and other PLBs use a mesh of moving satellites I can imagine satellite accuracy being better....or if they use local beacons to transmit I would think they switch to that mode when rescuers get close.

SPOTs pretty dang good....

Here's a three day rally I did in 2011 that helped friends, family, and rally organizer keep tabs on me..and see me accomplish a pretty neat trick of 4500+ miles in 72 hours...a triple Bun Burner Gold! To those wondering about several skip spots (i.e. Chicago area and in Kansas)....I forgot to go back into broadcast mode...that wasn't the unit or the service. You can find (e.g. Gothenberg, Nebraska) where it did miss a single report, but was flanked by reports within 10 minutes after.

 

[McKay]

I was told by the communication company that supplies our school district maintenance vehicles and buses with radios and such, that the EPIRB was more accurate than Spot by far, but at a substantial cost difference. $100 for the unit $100 annual fees for the SPOT compared to ???
Does anyone know the cost of the EPIRB
Also something about the SPOT satellite get less actuate the further North you are.
Just what I heard.
Doesn't look like CoderRider is having any issues with his. How much further North do you want to go...

They are correct. My Epirb cost me roughly $400 with no annual contract. I can send 250 test messages before the unit disables those so as to preserve the five year battery.
So, in five years the Epirb is cheaper than the SPOT and when you press the 'come get me' button they will, 100% of the time

 

[McKay]

You mean the little flashing light that tells you its time to change the battery and then you still have 24-48 hours of continuous operation before it actually goes kaput? Doesn't seem an issue to me....or at least for the SPOT unit I have.


That certainly helps. However, I'd still like to see some empirical documentation to support your claim.

If you've run it until those lights flash, your testing your luck IMO.

When you ask to see "empirical documentation" should you not use a coverage map provided by the manufacturer your are trying to convince me is just as good?
Just askin'

Fact is they both work, one is a toy in comparison to a tool.
We pick up 6 or so Spot users every summer, they will bring the team close at least.

 

[Ignaciob]

when you press the 'come get me' button they will, 100% of the time

100%? Really? That's a big claim. Do you have documentation of this?

I Googled and found this and other pages that cast doubt on your 100% EPIRB system reliability claim.

To be fair I wouldn't make a claim that SPOT or the system is 100% either. I don't think there's data out there that support any specific claim at this point.

 

[Ignaciob]

When you ask to see "empirical documentation" should you not use a coverage map provided by the manufacturer your are trying to convince me is just as good?
Just askin'

Absolutely! If I could find a third party verifiable source I'd rather use it, but can't find any. As far as I can see I don't even find claims by the PLB manufacturers--let one third party sources. The toy seems to have more documentation than the tool.

So, I'm still wondering how you come to your 100% claim?

If you've run it until those lights flash, your testing your luck IMO.

I totally agree! That's why the flashing light is a welcome additional feature and I change as soon as I see it with the spare set my pocket or tank bag along the trail. Can you change batteries in an EPIRB..or how do you know if the batteries are low?

Fact is they both work, one is a toy in comparison to a tool. We pick up 6 or so Spot users every summer, they will bring the team close at least.

That sounds like a pretty effective toy. All 6 or so SPOT users rescued each Summer? Any missed? And how many EPIRB rescues picked up and how many missed?

P.S. I'm in the Emergency Management field too...local bi-county policy board. We had a report by staff on some recent SPOT and PLB data. The former was the most popular mode..our peers over on the coast flipped the equation with EPIRBS and boats.

 

[v12gte]

I will post pics of the install shortly, but I figured I should post my conclusion as the OP.

I decided to go with the ACR PLBeacon as my "Oh, Crap" solution. I also got the Garmin Zumo with the topo map and breadcrumbs feature for the navigation. I decided that I did not need the "post text messages" and "post my route to Facebook" features that the InReach and Spot devices provided. I also intercepted enough anecdotal evidence to lead me to believe that the satellites and response centers serving the PLBs were more robust than the commercial endeavors from Spot and InReach. But that was my private conclusion, and not a scientific study.

The ACR beacon now goes in the jacket pocket (It is small !), and the Zumo will move in between bikes. Although Garmin sure made it difficult to move it between bikes, since the coupler between the RAM and the GPS unit requires a hard-wired connection for each machine.

 

[McKay]

Absolutely! If I could find a third party verifiable source I'd rather use it, but can't find any. As far as I can see I don't even find claims by the PLB manufacturers--let one third party sources. The toy seems to have more documentation than the tool.

So, I'm still wondering how you come to your 100% claim?

EPIRBS use US military satellites for data, Spot uses old consumer satellites. Epirbs also dual transmit on 121.5mhz, the old emergency frequency. Their main is 406 Mhz.
SPot runs on a much less reliable frequency That's why Spot runs for 20 minuets.

I totally agree! That's why the flashing light is a welcome additional feature and I change as soon as I see it with the spare set my pocket or tank bag along the trail. Can you change batteries in an EPIRB..or how do you know if the batteries are low?

Not field serviceable, send to authorized shop (me in my case) for change in 5 years. Same batteries and system used in all US based aircraft today.

That sounds like a pretty effective toy. All 6 or so SPOT users rescued each Summer? Any missed? And how many EPIRB rescues picked up and how many missed?
They are...
Yes 6 or so are Spot rescues, we get very few Epirb calls. We equate that to the people using them are more likely to be prepared and experienced.
We've had one Epirb we couldn't locate and that was because it turned out to be a stolen unit and the guy that had it was traveling with it pushing buttons randomly. The military eventually found him if I recall.

P.S. I'm in the Emergency Management field too...local bi-county policy board. We had a report by staff on some recent SPOT and PLB data. The former was the most popular mode..our peers over on the coast flipped the equation with EPIRBS and boats.

 

[Johnrg]

I decided that I did not need the "post text messages" and "post my route to Facebook" features that the InReach and Spot devices provided.

The InReach offers 2 way communication For me that's the unique feature. Considered both of the above solutions but 2 way made it my choice. It's all good in any regard. Each have proven themselves to work, at a compelling price too.

 

[Abby]

For what it's worth, the spots work in hawaii

 

[nev..]

So, in five years the Epirb is cheaper than the SPOT and when you press the 'come get me' button they will, 100% of the time

I presume that means 100% of the time when the EPIRB signal is able to be received by the monitoring satellites. With the Spot, with tracking turned on, even if the SOS button is not pressed, even if the unit cannot get a GPS position fix due to unclear view of the sky, the previously reported tracking information will at least give an indication of the direction, speed and last known position, which would give anyone looking for you a huge heads up into where to start looking. I choose the Spot over EPIRB because it is multi function, and the only function which the EPIRB does better is the one function I will in all probability never need to use, so in your cost/benefit analysis of the two devices, you need to consider that the entire cost of the EPIRB is wasted if you never press the SOS button, whereas the other features of the Spot are used often, which means you do actually get some ongoing benefit or return from the subscription costs.

 

[McKay]

Your points are well received.

I presume that means 100% of the time when the EPIRB signal is able to be received by the monitoring satellites. With the Spot, with tracking turned on, even if the SOS button is not pressed, even if the unit cannot get a GPS position fix due to unclear view of the sky, the previously reported tracking information will at least give an indication of the direction, speed and last known position, which would give anyone looking for you a huge heads up into where to start looking. I choose the Spot over EPIRB because it is multi function, and the only function which the EPIRB does better is the one function I will in all probability never need to use, so in your cost/benefit analysis of the two devices, you need to consider that the entire cost of the EPIRB is wasted if you never press the SOS button, whereas the other features of the Spot are used often, which means you do actually get some ongoing benefit or return from the subscription costs.

 

[Coffee]

I presume that means 100% of the time when the EPIRB signal is able to be received by the monitoring satellites. With the Spot, with tracking turned on, even if the SOS button is not pressed, even if the unit cannot get a GPS position fix due to unclear view of the sky, the previously reported tracking information will at least give an indication of the direction, speed and last known position, which would give anyone looking for you a huge heads up into where to start looking. I choose the Spot over EPIRB because it is multi function, and the only function which the EPIRB does better is the one function I will in all probability never need to use, so in your cost/benefit analysis of the two devices, you need to consider that the entire cost of the EPIRB is wasted if you never press the SOS button, whereas the other features of the Spot are used often, which means you do actually get some ongoing benefit or return from the subscription costs.

This sounds right.

For the record I have a 406MHz EPIRB and it is *huge* because it is from the mid 1990's from when I went from CA->HI a couple of times.. I am not even sure what to do with it. Definitely too big for bike use.

It is nice to have options these days, for sure.

 

[TE250Guy]

Looks like CodgerRider has made it about as far north as you can go in Alaska/Yukon at the north end of the Dawson Highway. He is heading back! The Terra and the SPOT seem to be working fine. http://share.findmespot.com/shared/faces/viewspots.jsp?glId=0TLiDp5vhjn6n9pp7QKS2Nf2FdeM0mIk5.

 

[TE250Guy]

Looks like CodgerRider has made it about as far north as you can go in Alaska/Yukon at the north end of the Dawson Highway. He is heading back! The Terra and the SPOT seem to be working fine. http://share.findmespot.com/shared/faces/viewspots.jsp?glId=0TLiDp5vhjn6n9pp7QKS2Nf2FdeM0mIk5.

He is now in Prudhoe Bay, AK. Guess that answers the concerns about if the SPOT works up North. I haven't heard any ride reports, but am looking forward to his assessment of the Terra on this very LONG ride that started in Houston.

 

[Coffee]

He is now in Prudhoe Bay, AK.

Let us know if any pictures are eventually posted. Many years ago I considered a family vacation there just to do something different.

 

[TE250Guy]

Let us know if any pictures are eventually posted. Many years ago I considered a family vacation there just to do something different.

I was just posting his position on this thread since there have been some questions if the SPOT would work far north since the satellites are far south, maybe the equator? Kenneth Webb had the last posting with pictures that I know of here , post 89 and 90 http://www.cafehusky.com/threads/no...50-where-ya-gonna-go.28364/page-5#post-317182

Note that he is not using tracking, but is sending out an OK message. This will be more reliable since it tries several times unlike the tracking that tries only once, but does it every 10 minutes.

Here is what his route looks like in MAP view

Here is a zoom in to where he sent the message out on the SPOT. I could have zoomed in farther, but you get the idea.

 

[pasomonte]

OK, Kevin (I'll just call him Codger) is OK to post his spot link. http://share.findmespot.com/shared/faces/viewspots.jsp?glId=0TLiDp5vhjn6n9pp7QKS2Nf2FdeM0mIk5 Maybe this should be a separate post, but I'll wait to see if there is any interest to do it.

I use a Spot tracker (1stversion) all over the world. I clicked on your buddies, page and saw him get to Dawson but no more signal after. I know from personal experience that SPOT works fine there. Maybe his batteries are weak or he's brokedown?