You have to be kidding!

[Motosportz]

I think you have been watching too much US media. There has been a big push by US interests in recent years to create a very poor image of Chinese products in order to hurt the Chinese machine. China owns 25% of the US foreign debt ($800 Billion). Very bad situation for the US government. So a smear campiagn was launched recently in order to try to get US consumers to force US manufacturers to no longer produce products in China. If a large portion of US companies stopped manufacturing operations in China it would hurt their economy. That recent lead ban act was one such measure. Does anyone know how many products have lead in them? I bet nobody does....but how many ppl now think that most products made in China have lead in them?? How many US consumers will now not buy any product with the "Made In China" stamped because of the recent "news" stories. Why are these "stories" coming out now? Have Chinese manufacturers all of a sudden started adding lead to the products they build? Chinese made products were ok when China only owned 13% of US foreign debt but not now

I think ppl really need to open their eyes to what China is really about and not just take what you hear on the "news" as reality. Some of it may be true but it could also be a very small snapshot of the whole story.

Chinese manufacturers will be supplying some very good bikes soon and I say good for them.

It's pretty common knowledge what is happening and what we are getting. It is not some big political strategy IMHO it is truth. As I manufacture and have dealt with sourcing from abroad I have seen tons of this first hand. Bearings way out of spec, bolts made from the wrong materials, etc. the list is near endless. Ever been there and seen the manufacturing and how it is done? Scary crap.

Here is a fist hand example for you. I worked at Fastway some 7 years ago. We designed and had manufactured those wide foot pegs. After getting some done in the US we had a Asian manufacturer do some for us. Were about a 1/3 rd the price but WOW, the quality was bad. Rough pitted samples we kept sending back etc. Then when it was all solidified the boss man move forward thinking this was a good path to offer the pegs at a reasonable price. These were bought in batched of hundreds. They were specified to be 17-4 investment cast stainless steel. We received the first shipment (by boat across the ocean) opened them up and they were rusting. Huh? They said oops and sent more months later. more rust. huh? Took a set to the metallurgist to see what they were made of and it was some mix of whatever but not Investment cast 17-4 stainless. This is a often reoccurring issue and not myth. I have since spoke with MANY manufacturers in the industry and have heard these stories over and over. This is a personal experience situation. I have no need to make stuff up or smear anyone / country and gain nothing from posting this. It's just how it is from my point of view.

That said the Koreans are getting really good at building cars. I saw a Hyundi the other day i would have sworn was a Honda. Very nice fit and finish.

 

[LRPct]

It's pretty common knowledge what is happening and what we are getting. It is not some big political strategy IMHO it is truth. As I manufacture and have dealt with sourcing from abroad I have seen tons of this first hand. Bearings way out of spec, bolts made from the wrong materials, etc. the list is near endless. Ever been there and seen the manufacturing and how it is done? Scary crap.

Here is a fist hand example for you. I worked at Fastway some 7 years ago. We designed and had manufactured those wide foot pegs. After getting some done in the US we had a Asian manufacturer do some for us. Were about a 1/3 rd the price but WOW, the quality was bad. Rough pitted samples we kept sending back etc. Then when it was all solidified the boss man move forward thinking this was a good path to offer the pegs at a reasonable price. These were bought in batched of hundreds. They were specified to be 17-4 investment cast stainless steel. We received the first shipment (by boat across the ocean) opened them up and they were rusting. Huh? They said oops and sent more months later. more rust. huh? Took a set to the metallurgist to see what they were made of and it was some mix of whatever but not Investment cast 17-4 stainless. This is a often reoccurring issue and not myth. I have since spoke with MANY manufacturers in the industry and have heard these stories over and over. This is a personal experience situation. I have no need to make stuff up or smear anyone / country and gain nothing from posting this. It's just how it is from my point of view.

That said the Koreans are getting really good at building cars. I saw a Hyundi the other day i would have sworn was a Honda. Very nice fit and finish.

I've seen the very same thing Kelly... When I worked at Skip http://www.skipbarber.com/ we tried to source some formula car components out to suppliers in China.. the first couple batches we got were actually OK and we had no problems with them. After the first couple though what we started recieving was a joke. In no way could we get them to fit the way they were supposed to, and the overall quality was just in the crapper.

That being said though I would never put it past the propaganda pushing, commercial media throwing any government under the bus for any reasons we might not readily see. I barely put .01% of any faith in the media with what a commercial and entertainment driven industry it has become especially after the advent of cable and then the internet. I'd much rather trust what I can learn first hand from those that make a living in whatever subject I'm interested about, whether it be business owners like yourself, the actual soldiers on the ground etc.

The movie "Lions for Lambs" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lions_for_lambs touched on this a lil bit with Meryl Streep's (my neighbor BTW) character. I'm sure there's tons of other books and movies that talk on the subject even deeper, but I just saw this one the other day and thought it was a great movie.

We also better be careful not to P.O. China too much... Things are bad enough, if they were to call in that debt we owe them, we're screwed...It'd be one hell of a way for them to put "those arogant yanks" in their place as we are seen in much of the world.

Oh well.. back to Chinese bikes!!! and the Yanks /Angels game!!

 

[NumberCruncher]

We also better be careful not to P.O. China too much... Things are bad enough, if they were to call in that debt we owe them, we're screwed...It'd be one hell of a way for them to put "those arogant yanks" in their place as we are seen in much of the world.

Oh well.. back to Chinese bikes!!! and the Yanks /Angels game!!

I don't worry about pissing them off because if they call the loans, we don't have to pay . . .

Now if they call the debt, we don't pay, and they retaliate in some other economic way, we might be in trouble. Then again, the bully can always beat up the skinny rich kid if he has to.

NC

 

[Dirty Bikes]

It's pretty common knowledge what is happening and what we are getting.

Yes I agree that we are not getting a Lexus at Hyundia pricing...but we are getting more then we are paying for (in most cases).

I just think many ppl are very closed minded when it comes to products from China. You hear all these negative reports about product quality but very little of the good products. China manufactures thousands of products, some shite,some very good.

America manufactures thousands of products, some shite, most very good.

But products from China have improved drastically in the past few years.

Restriciting trade or spread propaganda in order to create protectionism is not going to help. That is exactly what has been happening in the past few years. "Stop buying Chinese" has now been followed up with "Start buying American"

http://www.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSTRE5142SM20090205

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2009/02/02/day-trade.html

You may think there is no hidden agenda but there is. China is a huge threat to the American economy and position as the word super power.

But if we step back and look at this from a strictly consumer perspective...China needs the US consumer to buy the products they produce. Therefore the American consumer has the power as to the level of products coming out of China. If it is shite don't buy it. If the value equation is good then buy it. Chinese manufacturers will get the idea when retailers and wholesalers stop importing the crappy stuff.

The US is built on capitalism and the power of the consumer. Why should that be any different if the manufacturer or supplier is in Indiana or Shanghai?

BTW here is a good website with a list of a lot of Chinese products...

http://www.made-in-china.com/

 

[Dirtdame]

Harbor Freight and Tool is a good example of what Americans love to buy. I don't love buying stuff from them, but often it's as far as my budget will stretch.

 

[Dirty Bikes]

Harbor Freight and Tool is a good example of what Americans love to buy. I don't love buying stuff from them, but often it's as far as my budget will stretch.

Why buy a Dewalt when sometimes a Chicago will do

Why buy a GPR when a Motorsportz will do

 

[LRPct]

I don't worry about pissing them off because if they call the loans, we don't have to pay . . .

Now if they call the debt, we don't pay, and they retaliate in some other economic way, we might be in trouble. Then again, the bully can always beat up the skinny rich kid if he has to.

NC

LOL. are WE the bully?? cause we sure seem to have been getting our ass handed to us for awhile now... http://costofwar.com/


Personally I'll buy what products I can afford that are of good quality. Hopefully I can do that where they come from places where labor is treated fairly and REALLY hopefully I can do that when they are made here...

 

[rasputin]

i don't care if the china bikes are good or bad quality. the only thing i expect from them is to play the game according to the rules. if they develop their own bikes and come up with their own style, they're welcome. but bikes like the mtm are just... cheating.

r

 

[racermx66]

Now I know where all of my recycled beer cans go; to make motorcycles in China. I saw an article recently where a Chinese company is buying Hummer from GM. They will still be made in the US but probably a lot of components will be made in China.

 

[krieg]

i don't care if the china bikes are good or bad quality. the only thing i expect from them is to play the game according to the rules. if they develop their own bikes and come up with their own style, they're welcome. but bikes like the mtm are just... cheating.

r

China has never played fair. Nor does it care about the rules. Now that it "owns" the debt of most of the free world, it can pretty much do as it pleases while thumbing it's nose. The really sad part is the fact that the leaders of the free world during the past 25 years were stupid enough to allow it to happen. China is now the world's biggest superpower and the rest of us seem to be content to roll over and take it.

 

[Dirty Bikes]

China has never played fair. Nor does it care about the rules. Now that it "owns" the debt of most of the free world, it can pretty much do as it pleases while thumbing it's nose. The really sad part is the fact that the leaders of the free world during the past 25 years were stupid enough to allow it to happen. China is now the world's biggest superpower and the rest of us seem to be content to roll over and take it.

Replace the word China with the word America and that is what the rest of the world has been saying for past 30-40 years. I am not hating on the US at all. I love my neighbour to the south. I am just say'n that is how it is. Being a Canadian I know what it is like to be a small fish in a big pond.

 

[krieg]

Replace the word China with the word America and that is what the rest of the world has been saying for past 30-40 years. I am not hating on the US at all. I love my neighbour to the south. I am just say'n that is how it is. Being a Canadian I know what it is like to be a small fish in a big pond.

You realize China is still communist... right? HUGE difference.

 

[Dirty Bikes]

You realize China is still communist... right? HUGE difference.

Not really. Seriously man put down your 1950's book on China.

I am not saying the country is a fine example of human rights. But what country really is....it is all about perspective I guess.

 

[krieg]

Not really. Seriously man put down your 1950's book on China.

I am not saying the country is a fine example of human rights. But what country really is....it is all about perspective I guess.

I trust you also understand they are currently the largest polluter on the planet, while still developing, and they have the largest population of any country on Earth? You may not be aware that they are building an average of 3 coal-fired power plants per month... to keep up with the demand for goods we buy from them... goods manufactured by kids and people who "earn" a wage that barely sustains life... right? My "book" on China was published TODAY.

 

[Dirty Bikes]

No offence (honest) but it sounds like you just watched Fox News report on China.

Did u know that only 50% of US households have access to recycling programs. Did u know that America did not sign the Koyto agreement (part of which included the reduction of coal plants). Do you know how much the average Mexican worker makes?

My point is that high pollution, poor wages and breaking rules is not just found in Communist countries.


I am not saying China is a great country. I certainly don't have a Chinese flag hanging on a wall. But remembering no country is without major issues. Throwing stones in a glass house yadda yadda yadda

 

[NumberCruncher]

LOL. are WE the bully?? cause we sure seem to have been getting our ass handed to us for awhile now... http://costofwar.com/


Personally I'll buy what products I can afford that are of good quality. Hopefully I can do that where they come from places where labor is treated fairly and REALLY hopefully I can do that when they are made here...

Put it this way. If China calls our debt and we say no. What can they do to make us pay? Nothing. If you don't make your house payment the bank can repossess your house. China repossess America? How?

NC

 

[rasputin]

this topic is heading in a strange direction...

r

 

[WoodsChick]

this topic is heading in a strange direction...

r

It certainly is...

I thought this was about motorcycles?



WoodsChick

 

[ARod2000]

Not really. Seriously man put down your 1950's book on China.

Maybe if your family came to America (or Canada) from a communist country you would understand.

 

[jaro51]

Put it this way. If China calls our debt and we say no. What can they do to make us pay? Nothing. If you don't make your house payment the bank can repossess your house. China repossess America? How?

NC

Yikes!!

Not to add fuel to this fire but if I may suggest taking a few minutes and do a bit of reading to grasp the situation before it's too late.