Poll - 449/511 EFI butterfly removal

[Motosportz]

Just so we can get a clear count and result condensed into one spot.

- this is regarding this thread and modifications...

http://www.cafehusky.com/threads/2011-te449-running-well-with-factory-efi-system-finally.41069/

 

[Thrasher]

Did it Love it: One 4 hour ride so far.

'13 511, FMF Powercore, Race map 3, PCV with Zip-Ty's Burson FB richer low RPM, home airbox mods.

 

[Dangermouse449]

I'm still amazed at the difference it made to my bike, I've had NO flame-outs in the last 2 rides & I love the way it just cracks open & hauls!
I'm getting on a bit for dirtbikes (46) but I lead our last group ride, & could pull out a sizable gap to the others in the group between turn-offs, awesome

 

[huskyboy410]

As I said in the other tread ...WoW!!!
Totally different bike power is great and probably for me the engine brake is even better. 511 race map 2 gutted standard akro pipe. Anyone who thinks they might do it ....don't think any longer... do it!!!

 

[James Patton]

I can tell a noticeable difference, pulls much harder, low end, no flame out fears, seems to start the same cold,
And better hot starts.

 

[R. Stephen]

Anyone have any cold or hot start issues after the mod?

 

[R. Stephen]

has anyone confirmed this? The only time the choke is needed on the TC449 is when it is hot. It's more like a hot start than a choke. I have over 100 hours on those bikes and never needed it when cold.

 

[9880sts]

It will make it more difficult to start in cold weather. I believe if you are running a pcv that you can adjust the cold start trigger to compensate.

Why should it make it more difficult to start when you remove the Butterfly ? The Ecu one is partly open any ways.
When u start the TE you can't really turn the throttle . So the ECU will control the Fuel with the main butterfly closed.

 

[9880sts]

After the long weekend ride's . I love the Bike.
I was out in a Group of 13 Bikes.
6 KTM 250/300 2T and some 350 - 530's.
1 GAS GAS 300
4 Yamaha's WR450f.
1 newish Yellow white KTM 250 2t. ---- He does not speak with the Red Husky rider ! What a TOSSER. i made sure through the ride that some debris went his way.
1--- TE 511----

the comment from most of Guys was just , how Incredible good the bikes goes.
Because as i showed up, mentioned to the other Guys , that the 511 is a fake. Has only 477 ccm and is a RED BMW G450.
I thought i throw his Austrian Shitbox on the Ground and just smash it a bits.

Well the 530 could not pull up beside me at all anymore. 450's are a no go too.
And 4 wanted to have a ride with it , just because of the FLEXBAR's. But came back and couldn't believe how fukn good this thing pulls and Handles.

I always looked at other bikes when they pulled away, i was missing that raw power. Here it is now. Just to see other Guys impressed with it makes me smile... because i did not install PCV and JD tuner. Didn't Change Camshafts and / or heads to get a result.

To see someone just getting of my bike and smiling !!!. I don't wan't to hear things like '" Userfriendly" or " Yeah it goes allright '' or " i thought for a 480cc bike it should pull harder".

I want to hear things like ... damn what a power station / can't believe thats only 477cc.

Just one Picture from KINGLAKE VICTORIA terrain.
Steep Hills and Gullys.

 

[Mr Ford40]

So far I've done everything apart from the Akro/Race map 3 Thats booked in for saturday morning for the ECU upgrade at Lillydale Victoria , Then I will let you know how much better it is yet again. A little more oil and thinner oil will help {THANKS TINKEN } buy rights should make alittle more power at run cooler.

 

[Mr Ford40]

After the long weekend ride's . I love the Bike.
I was out in a Group of 13 Bikes.
6 KTM 250/300 2T and some 350 - 530's.
1 GAS GAS 300
4 Yamaha's WR450f.
1 newish Yellow white KTM 250 2t. ---- He does not speak with the Red Husky rider ! What a TOSSER. i made sure through the ride that some debris went his way.
1--- TE 511----

the comment from most of Guys was just , how Incredible good the bikes goes.
Because as i showed up, mentioned to the other Guys , that the 511 is a fake. Has only 477 ccm and is a RED BMW G450.
I thought i throw his Austrian Shitbox on the Ground and just smash it a bits.

Well the 530 could not pull up beside me at all anymore. 450's are a no go too.
And 4 wanted to have a ride with it , just because of the FLEXBAR's. But came back and couldn't believe how fukn good this thing pulls and Handles.

I always looked at other bikes when they pulled away, i was missing that raw power. Here it is now. Just to see other Guys impressed with it makes me smile... because i did not install PCV and JD tuner. Didn't Change Camshafts and / or heads to get a result.

To see someone just getting of my bike and smiling !!!. I don't wan't to hear things like '" Userfriendly" or " Yeah it goes allright '' or " i thought for a 480cc bike it should pull harder".

I want to hear things like ... damn what a power station / can't believe thats only 477cc.

Just one Picture from KINGLAKE VICTORIA terrain.
Steep Hills and Gullys.
View attachment 40043

9880sts THATS SOME STEEP COUNTRY I USED TO DOWN RACE THERE ON DOWN HILL MOUNTAIN BIKES. YEAH BABY 8 INCHS OF TRAVEL FRONT AND BACK SUSPENSION.

 

[Dangermouse449]

Anyone have any cold or hot start issues after the mod?

Defiantly no hot start issues. Ridden mine in 35 degC heat & all sweet.
Cold start should remain the same if you are only doing the butterfly mod.
The ecu still adds extra fuel for cold start (based on coolant & air temp sensors) & if the fast idle arm remains, then it will lift the idle, cold start shouldn't be affected. (To lift the fast idle arm, the top butterfly shaft has to turn, thereby opening the butterfly as well. It would not work as a 'choke' in this instance)

I do not live where it snows, 5 degC is about as cold as we get here, so I can't confirm one way or the other.
You can always re-install the butterfly if it has trouble in winter

 

[danny318]

Mine has been starting great cold and hot since the mod.

 

[Dangermouse449]

has anyone confirmed this? The only time the choke is needed on the TC449 is when it is hot. It's more like a hot start than a choke. I have over 100 hours on those bikes and never needed it when cold.

The 'choke' on a TC is a fast idle knob, it just lets in extra air around the throttle butterfly.

It's how I wish the TEs were from new

 

[Dangermouse449]

When Ty and I built my WR511 last March, we removed the primary butterfly and tried milling the TE throttle body to accept the TC choke, but the material had been removed preventing such installation. I will look again to see if a plug can be machined and can be added when I have time.

That'd be a nice addition for the bike in a cold climate & no idle arm.

I haven't hooked up a tach to the 449 as yet, but I have it idling fine hot or cold without the idle arm, catches first crank each time.
The TE sounds about the same idle as my EFI CRF450R by ear, it is running about 1900rpm.

 

[Dangermouse449]

Spoke to the technician at my local dealer yesterday.
He can't recall if the different ECU added to my bike back during warranty work has Map3 or not.
They are waiting for their KTM updated software/hardware package & their HST is down so I'll have to wait until later to find out if it is loaded.....

I also mentioned politely that the previous work hadn't fixed it, but pulling the butterfly had.
He said they were a little quiet this week (short week of public holidays) so he might give it a try on a used shop bike they have there.
I think he'll be very surprised

 

[Thrasher]

Second 2 hour test ride with butterfly removed. All went well.

Noticed on steep, 2nd gear hill climb when that scary moment comes when you think, "OH NO! I'm going too slow for 2nd. I need to shift down... but I'm using 100% concentration and my foot is in the wrong spot... I'M GOING TO STALL! I NEED TO SHIFT DOWN!!" ...... you know, we've all been there.... well, no need to shift, just twist the throttle farther. No stall. No flameout. No hesitation, just MONSTER pulling on slow, rutted, super steep hills, in 2nd! It didn't pull like that before butterfly removal.

 

[Motosportz]

I have agreed (through some behind the scenes email bashing) to test the butterfly option further as time permits.

you can thank me later. ...and it was not bashing just subjective info based on real world testing.

I see the beneficial effects from this removal, but the long term effects are what interest me.

Not sure what they could be as the ECU does not know it was removed and is still doing its thing.

 

[Dangermouse449]

Not exactly sure why their HST is down or if an update from KTM is such a good thing considering their system on the exc's. If you plug your ecu into the HST, even if not online, you can run a data diagnostic and it will tell you right there if map 3 is loaded or not.

Only going by what he told me.
I'm away again for work now, but I'll call in on them when home & see if they can hook it up. (They're a 40 min drive away also)
Sounded like their HST had died the way he was talking.
They should have had software there for all the 'new' Huskys anyhow as they were the local Berg dealer already.....

 

[Dangermouse449]

You are assuming it's actions are based upon set programming and not reactions to the sensors. We'll see.

(Tongue in cheek) - I don't think the system is that smart

If it were, feedback of changes from a piggyback system would be more likely to give problems. (And only in closed loop running)
The system can still turn the throttle shaft, it watches the 2nd tps to see if it did & confirm it.
The only way it could 'know' if there's something amiss is through poor fueling read in closed loop mode with the o2 sensor installed.

I know you aren't a fan, but I now have 20 hours since the removal & it is still awesome.
First time starts hot or cold, great throttle response, no flame-outs & no dead throttle issues.

Whatever the original cause of any of these faults, along with the butterfly, & other mods, there are gone.