IICE Tune may work for TR650...

[Trapperj]

The IICE Gizmo..by poolside that's so popular for all BMW FI engines may work for the TR650 too.
I emailed him (user name is poolside on Adv. Rider) and his response was he thought it would ..but was not 100% sure as the parts Fiche online wasn't to be found....he thinks our Huskys will have the same Air intake temp sensor...if that's the case then it's just a matter of plugging it up. Just another option for those wanting better throttle response...and for less money than some others. I believe his IICE is $75 plus shipping. You do have to purchase it up front...and there's a several week wait. I have one on my R1200 GS and it works as described. He has sold over 400 of these to happy BMW F/I owners worldwide. It's a quality piece for sure.

I ordered one several weeks ago for my GS..that should be delivered soon. I ran across a used one from a friend that sold his bike and snatched it up...so I'll have a extra one. Just as quick as it arrives I'll see if it plugs in and report back.

For those that want to know more look for Hot ridding the GS in the vendors section on Adv. Rider....tons of info there.

 

[Allen]

I have one of these in the mail. I think it will be here within a month or so. I will post some pics of the install.

 

[Motosportz]

Is this basically an adjustable temp sensor fooler?

 

[Trapperj]

SORRY..TO CALL A IAT FOOLER A tune" my bad...its just a Gizmo ...but does work much like the others available..Yes...it's adjustable...even has the stock sdjustment as well. Pretty slick. Very popular with all the GS bunch from 1100 through to the new LC too. I have one on my GS. ended up with a B/P on the TR..Ran into a good buy. I reckon they all work the same. This one is cheap enough and good quality IMHO...just not available without a wait..the BP works great on the TR..I may try the one above on the TR later just to see if the adjustability makes much difference. It runs so good right now I don't even think about this stuff except when in these threads..lol

 

[Allen]

The only reason I went with IICe and not a wuka king or the like is that there might be some other mods developed by the guy who engineered this. Also after reading his posts on FI throttle response I figured he was pretty got at what he did so I decided to buy.

 

[run-it]

The only reason I went with IICe and not a wuka king or the like is that there might be some other mods developed by the guy who engineered this. Also after reading his posts on FI throttle response I figured he was pretty got at what he did so I decided to buy.

Cancel order, do the eruption mod or buy a PC. Just my opinion.

 

[Allen]

Cancel order, do the eruption mod or buy a PC. Just my opinion.

Why do you think the eruption is better?

 

[nev..]

Why do you think the eruption is better?

Probably because it's cheaper, which is odd, because then he suggests a much more expensive alternative. Often people with a skill that they have practiced and can perform easily, where that skill might be holding a pair of pointy nose pliers in one hand and soldering two tiny wires together neatly with the other hand forget that these are not skills that the average person has, and possibly not even the equipment the average person has, and stuffing it up once means buying all the bits again to start over, or trying to salvage a poorly done job, or just binning it and going for the alternative, like the IIce or Wuka plug, which is not unreasonably expensive, and is a simple plug and play solution that only required taking a few screws out and working out a funny clip. I envy his ability to design and build such a neat solution to the problem.

 

[run-it]

Why do you think the eruption is better?

Hi Allen, when I was in the market for a spoofer I was thinking I'd just buy "the juice" the non-switchable unit with a 20C offset. I didn't consider a product from PS b/c I thought the lead time was absurd. So I didn't do any research on his stuff, I read a little though before posting my comment above, & frankly what I read disturbed me a little.

It seems everyone who sells these spoofers takes some degree of "license" in describing them, how they work & what they'll do for you. BTW they don't call them spoofers b/c that sounds simplistic & a bit derogatory but that's what they are.

PS takes it to a whole new level that would make Mr. Haney from Green Acres blush. Could it be this is why some people referred to these products as snake oil? It must've set off their BS meter. As for being disturbed, maybe astounded is a better word or dis-tounded. I don't know whether to applaud his literary creativity or condemn it.

What I saw was a device that was switchable with 0, 10, 20 & 30C offsets & NO remote thermistor probe. I saw a vague promise to have other products coming that would work with this unit in time. I think that was two years ago.

If you want a plug-in spoofer W-king, juice, booster plug will be an improvement, things that use an external probe are preferred.

If you want a spoofer that doesn't deviate from hitting it's target at extreme temps, is cable-less, elegant & just happens to be inexpensive that's the eruption.

Remember, I don't have a horse in this race, I'm selling nada. I would advise a friend not to be led down a beautifully painted road that in my mind is more akin to a rabbit hole.

Let's pretend for a minute the PS product was an external probe spoofer & just as good as the others mentioned. I don't see a lot of potential for future add-on modules if/when they come. Plus there's a price point in which I'd rather go with a PC. Those add-on modules would probably push it into that area.

Quick read summary:
1) Eruption - best spoofer mod for the TR
2) BP & the juice - gets the job done too - not as accurate
3) PC - Best solution w/ regard to a/f ratios, future engine modding, (w/o cost considerations)

If anyone cares to learn about spoofers, as I recall, the BP website had the most direct & complete information of those that are selling them.

I hope that helps.

 

[Allen]

I don't think you have read enough. PS actually comments on the market just like you did - that there are a lot of people that claim to have a "license" etc.

His product is not expensive - I am sure sure it is not the cheapest but it is reasonably priced. So I don't think he is exactly getting rich off the "snake oil".

Realisitically I just bought his product because I didn't mind the wait time ( I had four months before I would get the bike), I have read his posts and he knows what he is doing, it is easily removable, looks quality, and uses the stock BMW connectors.

I also hadn't heard of the Eruption when I ordered - I still have not researched it.

Why are external probes preferred?

 

[Trapperj]

I started this thread and used the wrong title to describe the product...it is not a "tune" I knew this but to be honest as poorly as most of our TRs ran stock...it made my TR feel like it had the greatest tune ever.

Going the PC route is a good option I reckon..(real tune)...if exhaust and other farkles make it to us....fingers crossed

 

[run-it]

Allen, the technique is subtle & suave - no doubt, but I really do think I read enough to get the general lay of the land.

I'm not surprised there's a following, even a degree of excitement. I'm sure it's cultivated. 95% of the general public will eat it up.

No, it's not expensive when compared with other devices but imo others are better represented & likely to perform better.

External probes at least allow you some leeway in where to place the probe on any given bike model so that you can minimize effects from false hot / cold influences.

Only the eruption will give you a true, instant 20C offset from the air that is actually going into your engine - unless you put the sensing probe of a cabled spoofer in your airbox which some, Bigdog I think, have.

But even then I estimate the eruption sensors to be faster acting to ambient changes & of course to hold the 20C offset at temperature extremes better. Not to mention no cables or probe running about.

For anyone else that's wondering about the eruption mod, it only requires basic skills, like you can read & have two hands . For tools; pliers, wire cutters, razor, soldering iron about covers it. Plus tools to take your panels off. For materials; heat shrink, thermistors & rosin core solder. If someone is new to soldering, I was in Wally world yesterday, they had a solder iron for like $8, I've seen them at the automotive stores (Kragen, Autozone) for $7 - they have rosin core solder too. HF & Radio Shack has them. Watch some u-tube vids, practice, then perform the outpatient operation.

Hope that helps.

 

[Abby]

So, in child-like terms, can you tell me what the difference is between the wuki-king and the eruption thing?

I get that telling the computer its colder outside makes the bike run better cause it burns more fuel.

But what's the difference betwen the way the wuki-king does it and the eruption?

 

[kjackbrown]

So, in child-like terms, can you tell me what the difference is between the wuki-king and the eruption thing?

I get that telling the computer its colder outside makes the bike run better cause it burns more fuel.

But what's the difference betwen the way the wuki-king does it and the eruption?

Basically, the difference between them are the devices which they use to take the temp readings.

 

[run-it]

Abbey, the cabled spoofers like WK work with the existing IAT (intake air thermistor) and try to duplicate its temperature/resistance curve, but they can't exactly. As long as the probe is sensing air that's representative of intake air, they're close enough around the most common riding temperatures but will deviate pretty good by 0 & 50C.

In child-like terms, they color outside the lines when they get hot & color short of the lines when they get cold.

They color jagged at the lines if the sensing probe is exposed to temperatures that don't represent intake air temperatures.

How much outside the lines? 22% too rich by 50C & 24% too lean by 0C. Those are estimates but they're honest estimates. If someone posts R/T values of one of these cabled spoofers we'll know.

The eruption comparatively colors nicely at the lines at those temps & anything in between.

The eruption isn't prone to making jagged lines b/c it IS measuring intake air temp not a facsimile.

 

[nev..]

Abbey, the cabled spoofers like WK work with the existing IAT (intake air thermistor) and try to duplicate its temperature/resistance curve, but they can't exactly. As long as the probe is sensing air that's representative of intake air, they're close enough around the most common riding temperatures but will deviate pretty good by 0 & 50C.

In child-like terms, they color outside the lines when they get hot & color short of the lines when they get cold.

They color jagged at the lines if the sensing probe is exposed to temperatures that don't represent intake air temperatures.

How much outside the lines? 22% too rich by 50C & 24% too lean by 0C. Those are estimates but they're honest estimates. If someone posts R/T values of one of these cabled spoofers we'll know.

The eruption comparatively colors nicely at the lines at those temps & anything in between.

The eruption isn't prone to making jagged lines b/c it IS measuring intake air temp not a facsimile.

You'll have to excuse my lack of knowledge on how these things work, and the difference it makes, but the way I understand it is that Husqvarna probably tune the bike for best performance, and then adjust that (make it run worse) probably in order to meet emissions laws, and that makes the bike run too lean. The purpose of the booster type plugs and your modification is to trick the bike into believing that the temperature is different to what it really is, in order to make it run better, and that the consensus is that a -20C adjustment at most temperatures performs this adequately. Now whether or not this -20C adjustment is scientific, or whether it's just arbitrary I don't know. So my question is, is it scientific, or is it just arbitrary? and is the adjustment true for every temperature, that is, if you were to put the bikes on a dyno, or have some other way to determine the ideal outcome, how important is colouring within the lines? Anecdotal evidence from these forums shows that people using the same plug in both hemispheres of the world, at opposite seasons, are reporting equally positive results, so is the difference between colouring within the lines and colouring over the lines really going to be that big an issue? The plugs which colour outside the lines are still going to be better than better at the extremes you mention than stock mapping right?

 

[mag00]

I just ordered up a new air sensor. They say two weeks. I am going to try the eruption scheme. I like what it is about. I like the no wires. The wuka is nice, it has a two position switch for hotter and colder temps. Just need to order up the thermistors now.

I think I will call mine, the...


Wait for it....



The Rattler....

 

[mag00]

Run-it, please excuse my humor, I am in no way disrespecting the research and work you have provided to get the eruption technoogy. Thank you much.

I'm merely poking fun at the name and the rest of the comments on snake oil, and some other stuff that just happened to fit in with "The Rattler", a snake. Being in the desert, it just has a bit more favorable name, the rattler.

 

[Coffee]

It's fairly simple. Characterize the stock OEM resistance of the temp sensor while measuring the air/fuel ratio, then 'somehow' adjust the resistance of the OEM or other temp sensor for the desired air/fuel ratio.

Doing that for the expected riding temperatures would be all that is required.

I will quite probably do that at some point just out of curiosity, but in the meantime I had a booster plug installed.

 

[run-it]

You'll have to excuse my lack of knowledge on how these things work, and the difference it makes, but the way I understand it is that Husqvarna probably tune the bike for best performance, and then adjust that (make it run worse) probably in order to meet emissions laws, and that makes the bike run too lean. The purpose of the booster type plugs and your modification is to trick the bike into believing that the temperature is different to what it really is, in order to make it run better, and that the consensus is that a -20C adjustment at most temperatures performs this adequately. Now whether or not this -20C adjustment is scientific, or whether it's just arbitrary I don't know. So my question is, is it scientific, or is it just arbitrary? and is the adjustment true for every temperature, that is, if you were to put the bikes on a dyno, or have some other way to determine the ideal outcome, how important is colouring within the lines? Anecdotal evidence from these forums shows that people using the same plug in both hemispheres of the world, at opposite seasons, are reporting equally positive results, so is the difference between colouring within the lines and colouring over the lines really going to be that big an issue? The plugs which colour outside the lines are still going to be better than better at the extremes you mention than stock mapping right?

So my question is, is it (this -20C adjustment) scientific, or is it just arbitrary?

Nev, as you implied, the -20C /6% enrichment value is known to work well with most OEM maps. I guess you could call it scientific but it’s certainly not exact. The same cabled spoofer is sold for many bike models & there’s bound to be variations in what would be optimal among them.

…is the difference between colouring within the lines and colouring over the lines really going to be that big an issue?

I estimate most people that have bikes that came new w/ overly lean A/F ratios will be satisfied with the outward operation of their cabled spoofer. There have been some that were less than thrilled & reported overly rich conditions. Due to the inherent deviation error in cabled spoofers it’s more likely to happen in hot weather & lengthy durations of operating in the modified open loop map. Like trail riding. Certain bike models will no doubt be more prone than others.


The plugs which colour outside the lines are still going to be better at the extremes you mention than stock mapping right?

For those models that came lean when new, including the TR, yes.