630 Water Pump re-seal-Details & pics.

[shoolsema]

I had oil leaking externally down the left side of the head. My coolant was murky and i had moisture in oil sight glass. The milky residue in the oil sight glass could have been from condensation and not the water pump?

picture of coolant that came out:

picture of coolant after sitting for a couple days:

This is the interesting part. The water pump drive shaft has a bearing. This bearing rides inside a little cup. The cup is part of the water pump base plate. This picture is of the cup:

This is the water pump bearing:

Notice the bearing is not centered in the hole in the side of the head? There is LESS gap on the bottom. And the water pump shaft is not moveable or bendable. It was impossible to get the water pump base plate back on? The bearing CUP would just hit the outer bearing race (on the bottom of course). I tried and tried and tried. I poked, tapped, hammered, twisted....nothing! Just TOO tight on the bottom. I even turned the engine over to see if the water pump shaft was possibly bent? In the end i had to take a die grinder to the lip of the bearing cup. I had to put a taper on the lip so i could get it past the outer bearing race. Weird? Also, if you look at the picture of the bearing cup to can see that the outer race of bearing is pressing on the lower half of the cup. It's like the hole in the head isn't cast just perfect?

Anyways, everything looks good now. No oil in coolant. No oil leaking down the side of the head.

 

[strongleftleg]

That mis-alignment of the bearing and the cup is a head scratcher.
Someone else who has had their water pump off needs to verify if this is normal or a one-off.

 

[mekanik]

I am not under standing the no warranty part, these machines have a two year warranty, any mods re: die grinder would void dealer participation?

 

[shoolsema]

I am not under standing the no warranty part, these machines have a two year warranty, any mods re: die grinder would void dealer participation?

My bike has about 10 holes in the air box, JD tuner pushing way more fuel that stock, do my oil changes with oil I get free from work (no reciepts for oil)....not sure what they would say about the warranty. I'm sure there are some great dealerships out there, but I've pretty much given up. Sick of having my stuff sit at there dealership for weeks. The seal i needed was $2. Called my dealership and they don't stock WP seals. So, I ordered it from Halls, they had everything in stock, shipped the same day, repairs took me an hour. Die grinding a taper on the bearing cap? What would the 22 year old kid at the dealership do? Bang it in with a hammer?
Maybe i'm just impatient? Just didn't want to wait.

 

[willie]

Looks to me like the water pump housing doubles as the bearing support. I think if you released the cam chain tension the bearing will loosen up enough to wiggle the water pump housing on. I hope you did not grind much metal off. Any missalignment will be detramental to cam gear alignment!

 

[Fast1]

From the Shop Manual

Water pump body removal
- Remove head cover, camshafts and chain tensioner as described in the
relevant paragraph.
Loosen the clamp (1) securing the water pump to cylinder head tube (2) and
take the tube out of the head.
Remove the two screws (3) securing pump body (4) to head (8 mm wrench)
and remove pump body and timing drive gear (5).
Check the seal (8) for wear on assembly;
replace if damaged.
Water pump disassembly
- Loosen the screw (9) with an 8 mm wrench to take pump body apart.
- Loosen the nut (10) to remove the impeller (11).
- Remove shaft (12) to replace bearing (13) and seal (14).
Check the seal (15) for wear on assembly;
replace if damaged.
- Reassemble all parts in the reverse order compared to disassembly and
tighten nut (10) to 4.9 Nm/ 0.5 Kgm/ 3.6 ft/Ib+LOCTITE 648).

 

[mekanik]

My bike has about 10 holes in the air box, JD tuner pushing way more fuel that stock, do my oil changes with oil I get free from work (no reciepts for oil)....not sure what they would say about the warranty. I'm sure there are some great dealerships out there, but I've pretty much given up. Sick of having my stuff sit at there dealership for weeks. The seal i needed was $2. Called my dealership and they don't stock WP seals. So, I ordered it from Halls, they had everything in stock, shipped the same day, repairs took me an hour. Die grinding a taper on the bearing cap? What would the 22 year old kid at the dealership do? Bang it in with a hammer? I can't see them ordering me a new head. Did my apprenticeship at a dealership, so I know the dealerships don't have any secrets.
Maybe i'm just impatient? Just didn't want to wait.

I probably bought my bike from the same dealer, I doubt the taaper on the cap would be detrimental to the bearing life, I am sure any flat-rate mechanic at a dealer will do the same if they read your post and learn your secrets. I am hoping a dealer in B.C. will step up to the plate and do warranty on modded bikes. All your mods have no effect on the water pump.

 

[capt42104]

Looks to me like the water pump housing doubles as the bearing support. I think if you released the cam chain tension the bearing will loosen up enough to wiggle the water pump housing on. I hope you did not grind much metal off. Any missalignment will be detramental to cam gear alignment!

DITTO! I would also be cautious of proper cam chain tension now. With the slack created by the removal of the bearing support, the tensioner may have tightened it up.

 

[shoolsema]

No, No, i didn't grind away the bearing support. I just put a little taper on the outer edge (or the lip) of the bearing cup so it would slip over the bearing nice. The area where the bearing rides is tottaly untouched...everything is as it was. Yes, I'm an idiot....but not a tottal hack! You guys are right, the key was backing off the cam chain tensioner and the bearing would have lifted up that 1/16" i needed. The 22 year old kid at the dealership WOULD have known that!! Crap! I wanted to quickly see what parts i needed, so i popped off the water pump before i left for work. I forgot the husky cam chain gear was on it's own little stubby shaft and NOT bolted directly to the cam (or cams). My fault! Being an idiot and rushing around! Should have looked at the book. Yup, i will pull the cam chain tensioner off and re-set it just to make sure it didn't go a click tighter.

well, if nothing else it's good for entertaiment value! hope everyone is having a good laugh! Guess I still had water in my coolant and oil running down the side of my head. And i have ordered parts form a couple of dealers on this website and they were great! But mostly my dealership experience (cars, trucks, bikes) has been poor. "Usually" it seems easier just to do it yourself.

 

[capt42104]

Sorry to give you a hard time! Make sure the cams are in time to the crank too. That "jack" shaft may have been able to come down enough to allow the cam gears to move from valve spring pressure.

 

[shoolsema]

Sorry to give you a hard time! Make sure the cams are in time to the crank too. That "jack" shaft may have been able to come down enough to allow the cam gears to move from valve spring pressure.

No sorry's man. my fault. That's what happens when I pipe off on the world wide web about crappy mechanics at dealerships. Licensed Equipment mechanic and i can't even figure out why the water pump on my dirt bike won’t slide back together. That’s why you never say “I’m a mechanic" or “I know what I’m doing” on the forums….it bites you in the ass!

Anyways, the "jack" shaft hardly moved. Bike runs smooth. I think it's ok. I'll reset the chain tensioner before i ride it again - just in case.

 

[capt42104]

Most excellent!

 

[shoolsema]

So i pulled the cam chain tensioner to make sure it didn't pop out a click. This time i read the manual 1st. Manual said remove centre bolt (on tensioner) and turn slotted screw to release spring tension. I had only seen the click type before. so i removed the tensioner to see how it works and for anyone that hasn't seen their 630 tensioner it looks like this:

Inside the hole there is a slotted screw. Turn in clockwise and it pulls the plunger in and releases pressure off the chain guide.

So, in the end its pretty easy to change the water pump seal and the 2 o-rings. Don't really need to remove the tensioner and wreck the gasket, just turn the screw and back off the tension. And i guess if you had the remove the WP drive then you need to pull the cams as stated above.

 

[Fast1]

Do you know if the water pump shaft bearing centered itself after releasing the cam chain tensioner? Guess that would require the water pump to be taken back apart to find out.

The tensioner looks very similar to that found on my old 08TE510

 

[shoolsema]

Do you know if the water pump shaft bearing centered itself after releasing the cam chain tensioner? Guess that would require the water pump to be taken back apart to find out.

The tensioner looks very similar to that found on my old 08TE510

Ya, i think the bearing would centre itself with the chain tension released. Might take some wiggling and tapping to get the bearing cup back over the bearing. But i'm pretty sure you wouldn't have to taper the bearing cup to get it started like i did.

 

[ray_ray]

I wish I had read this thread because I had pain changing my seal on my 08 TXC250 ... Looks like the same engine from the pics ...

I also had no idea that pump shaft had the timing gear on it also ... I didn't realize that and ended up with my bike out of time when it slide out as I was removing the plate that has the seal in it ... Then I could not get the cams out because the bolts holding them in were too tight ... I had to add my own marks on the back side of the cams and spin the cams with the chain off to get the timing right ...painful for me ...

So you pulled the shaft and cams and chain tension-er? I ended up pulling the latter but not the former ...

My shaft also had too big a groove worn in it from the first seal (850 hrs) and I had to replace the seal a second time because it quit sealing again after some miles ... I had a new seal but no shaft and the shaft has to be mailed to me from the states ... 10 days shipping

Here is my work around for a new seal but worn shaft till the new part arrives ... Replace the seal but do not drive the seal flush on its mounting plate. This puts the wire seal on the seal at a slightly different place on the shaft and will fix the leak for a limted time till you can get a new shaft ... also, I put HD grease inside the seal also to help block any water coming through ... Here is a pic of the seal as described here ...

The second time I removed the seal, I put the engine at TDC and took pics of the cams in case I got the engine out of time again ... Then I took the pump off, put the nut back on the shaft and placed a piece of wood against a wall and that shaft .. That held the shaft in place as I pried the plate off with the seal and bearing cup off the bike ... I reinstalled the seal and plate by using the bolts that hold the pump housing on the engine to pull the seal on and over the shaft ... Down and dirty style

 

[XLEnduroMan]

Dang, that does sound like the hard way of doing things ray_ray. Make sure to get the workshop manual and parts fisch next time. Having a lap top in the garage with the shop manual pulled up made the 310 kit install a lot easier for me.

 

[shoolsema]

Hey ray,
I just pulled the water pump off not knowing the cam gear was on the WP shaft. lucky for me the shaft and the cam gear did not slide out. If i was to do it all again i would just remove the chain tensioner and keep pressure on the WP shaft while i pulled the WP base plate off. Pretty much what you did.

 

[ray_ray]

Dang, that does sound like the hard way of doing things ray_ray. Make sure to get the workshop manual and parts fisch next time. Having a lap top in the garage with the shop manual pulled up made the 310 kit install a lot easier for me.

It was bad ... And I had no manual to start with ... It looked so simple to change the seal and then I realized I had the engine out of timing, I said WTF! This would never happen with a 2t ... Then when I realized I needed to remove the cams to time it, the bolts that hold the cams caps in place were super tight AND my hex head tools were not a good fit ... very loose fit like they were too small but I tried all sizes and they were either too big, too small, or the loosey goosey fit ... I got one loose with out stripping it and just stopped that approach ...

 

[ray_ray]

Hey ray,
I just pulled the water pump off not knowing the cam gear was on the WP shaft. lucky for me the shaft and the cam gear did not slide out. If i was to do it all again i would just remove the chain tensioner and keep pressure on the WP shaft while i pulled the WP base plate off. Pretty much what you did.

I did not even remove the tensioner the second time ... It will help hold the timing gear in place ... And I was ~100% sure on keeping that shaft from moving out any as the plate was removed ... So all the stuff was fitting tight and snug except for the nut on the end of the shaft puling all components tightly in place ..

But my bearing was straight in the hole also where yours was off-center ... Adding some slack to the chain was correct in your case...

What might have happened was that shaft or timing gear was not 100% inserted in the correct position causing the bearing to get misaligned ...

PS -- I gotta pull it all off again when the new shaft arrives