310R popping & hard start

[MZee]

I ride a 2014 TE 310R. Recently, the exhaust has been popping a lot when I close the throttle on downhill ( or corners). It also can be difficult to start when hot. The popping seems to be much worse at higher elevations (over 6000 ft ).

In effort to fix it, so far I have shimmed up an exh valve ( was .010, now .008) , new spark plug, put some injector cleaner in the gas.
The changes made to bike are, removed baffles in filter and horn, removed catalyst, had ECU changed to full power mode.

Stock muffler still on, O2 sensor still on.

The bike has always had a very rough, erratic idle, since new. Sometimes fires every other power stroke at idle. Runs great when throttle is twisted.

Do the stock mufflers get plugged, or need to be re-packed? It is riveted together, so not easily taken apart.
I read on other threads that the fuel pumps can go bad, and the gas can get too much engine heat - unless insulated. What are the symptoms?

Suggestions & advice welcomed. Thanks

 

[melias24]

Hey MZee, i have to say that the 4 stroke huskys can be hard to start. I didn't know that the injected ones were hard though. Anyway, my 2010 TC250f got hard to start from time to time. We redid the shims and it really did help the hot starting issues. I found that if you gave it the tiniest bit of throttle when starting hot was bad news.

Sorry i can't really help you form there, i knew that a rejet on the carb models would help. Sorry i can't help you from here since you've already shimmed it, and that's what fixed mine. Goodluck.

 

[Trenchcoat85]

I ride a 2014 TE 310R. Recently, the exhaust has been popping a lot when I close the throttle on downhill ( or corners). It also can be difficult to start when hot. The popping seems to be much worse at higher elevations (over 6000 ft ).

In effort to fix it, so far I have shimmed up an exh valve ( was .010, now .008) , new spark plug, put some injector cleaner in the gas.
The changes made to bike are, removed baffles in filter and horn, removed catalyst, had ECU changed to full power mode.

Stock muffler still on, O2 sensor still on.

The bike has always had a very rough, erratic idle, since new. Sometimes fires every other power stroke at idle. Runs great when throttle is twisted.

Do the stock mufflers get plugged, or need to be re-packed? It is riveted together, so not easily taken apart.
I read on other threads that the fuel pumps can go bad, and the gas can get too much engine heat - unless insulated. What are the symptoms?

Suggestions & advice welcomed. Thanks

sounds like you're running lean (and yes, the stock muffler can get plugged- but that'd make it rich).

is your vacuum port unconnected (it should be capped or have a vac hose connected)? check your manifold clamps and your header bolts. check your manifold for leaks or cracks and around your injector (use carb cleaner or wd-40 while idling; but someone will jump in with the suggestion to use an unlit propane torch- safer but not as convenient). is your cold start screw adjusted correctly (34+ clicks out IIRC) and is it pushed in? how does it pull at full throttle (if less than a rocket ship, I'm thinking fuel filter/hose/pump/injector)? spark plug seated and tight?

good luck

 

[MZee]

sounds like you're running lean (and yes, the stock muffler can get plugged- but that'd make it rich).

is your vacuum port unconnected (it should be capped or have a vac hose connected)? check your manifold clamps and your header bolts. check your manifold for leaks or cracks and around your injector (use carb cleaner or wd-40 while idling; but someone will jump in with the suggestion to use an unlit propane torch- safer but not as convenient). is your cold start screw adjusted correctly (34+ clicks out IIRC) and is it pushed in? how does it pull at full throttle (if less than a rocket ship, I'm thinking fuel filter/hose/pump/injector)? spark plug seated and tight?

good luck

Vac port is plugged. Will check intake manifold. Will idle speed up if I do the WD40 test if it has air leak ? Would ether start fluid work? Will check idle screw adjustment. I have never had it at full throttle. Too fast. It is a ripper at half or 3/4 throttle. Does stock muffler check require drilling out all rivets?

 

[Johnrg]

I had same symptoms and yes more so at high elevations. My wish was for a map switch and use of a high elevation map. The issue is the bike using Map 3 at idle and up to 15% throttle it's rich. Understandable so since "open map 3 means open pipe" or close to. Now Map 3 is very good coming from stock and not really running at all well, but I solved it completely, and others have verified it. I had Dynojet install a PCV a couple of years ago. I asked they install Autotune and it's wide band sensor, plus a map switch so I could make a high elevation map.

I posted tables of the corrections to Open Map 3 over the years on this forum. Popping on decell. from elevation and hot start issues were the issues. All fixed. The percentage changed to the low speed fueling is 10% or so, but that's enough to cause issues that get worse at elevation. Others here have purchased their PCVs and installed them using two maps I had posted with good results, such as more power all over and all symptoms going away. So that's the complete remedy. Or one has to live with some popping and hot start issues especially at elevation.

http://www.cafehusky.com/threads/power-commander-5-and-autotune-on-a-13-te-310r.44827/#post-444299

more...
http://www.cafehusky.com/threads/2013-te310r-powercommander-v-help.83104/page-2#post-568264

 

[Trenchcoat85]

Vac port is plugged. Will check intake manifold. Will idle speed up if I do the WD40 test if it has air leak ? Would ether start fluid work? Will check idle screw adjustment. I have never had it at full throttle. Too fast. It is a ripper at half or 3/4 throttle. Does stock muffler check require drilling out all rivets?

your muffler is fine- don't drill.
starting fluid- yes, it'll work... almost too good. very dangerous too. be careful.
wd40 is 60% naphtha (white gas, coleman fuel) so yeah: idle speed goes up.

go slow, be smart, be safe. good luck.

 

[Trenchcoat85]

hey, isn't this the same problem you had in June? http://www.cafehusky.com/threads/exhaust-popping.84294/

Pls stick to one thread. This keeps things from getting spread out all over. Didja notice that my litany of tests and points to look out for are almost repeated verbatim from 2 months ago?

Also, depending on the amount of responses- you have a minor obligation to come back with any final results, solutions, or observations.... for the future readers 4 years from now.

 

[MZee]

hey, isn't this the same problem you had in June? http://www.cafehusky.com/threads/exhaust-popping.84294/

Pls stick to one thread. This keeps things from getting spread out all over. Didja notice that my litany of tests and points to look out for are almost repeated verbatim from 2 months ago?

Also, depending on the amount of responses- you have a minor obligation to come back with any final results, solutions, or observations.... for the future readers 4 years from now.

Oops. Yes, it would have made sense to continue the same thread. I thought I got the prob fixed with new spark plug, injector cleaner and valve shim. Then went on a ride at higher elevation - over 6k - to discover that the problems persist. So, will check for the in / ex leaks, try under tank insulation, and check for flywheel or stator slippage. The elevation factor has me thinking it may be an FI problem, as suggested in post above.

 

[Trenchcoat85]

yeah- that timing change, with the rotor key getting sheared, would be huge. (everybody else: this is from the other thread)

I don't know if you can see it by inspection or hafta remove the rotor... but at least put a socket on the nut. (maybe someone that has experienced this will chime in)

I'm wondering if the manifold air pressure sensor (aka "absolute", or "atmospheric" sensor which is a terrible name) might be bad??? or if the port to the outside air (???) is clogged.

I have heard that a bad cylinder temp sensor will cause havoc

 

[dappleby]

Oops. Yes, it would have made sense to continue the same thread. I thought I got the prob fixed with new spark plug, injector cleaner and valve shim. Then went on a ride at higher elevation - over 6k - to discover that the problems persist. So, will check for the in / ex leaks, try under tank insulation, and check for flywheel or stator slippage. The elevation factor has me thinking it may be an FI problem, as suggested in post above.

Hi MZee,

So you don't get any of the symptoms below 6000ft? My '14 also has the same symptoms but I am not riding anywhere near 6000ft. Got a map, water and air temp sensor on the way. Going to replacing them. I too replaced the plug and checked the value clearances (but it made no change). If the sensors don't yield anything ill look at injector and or fuel pump etc.

Mine runs smooth with cold. Idle is fine and no popping. Once it's gets hot it then starts to idle hunt and pop on decel. Can be also hard to start immediately after stalled but if i wait a few minutes fires up first go.

Regards,
Daniel

 

[Trenchcoat85]

Hi MZee,

So you don't get any of the symptoms below 6000ft? My '14 also has the same symptoms but I am not riding anywhere near 6000ft. Got a map, water and air temp sensor on the way. Going to replacing them. I too replaced the plug and checked the value clearances (but it made no change). If the sensors don't yield anything ill look at injector and or fuel pump etc.

Mine runs smooth with cold. Idle is fine and no popping. Once it's gets hot it then starts to idle hunt and pop on decel. Can be also hard to start immediately after stalled but if i wait a few minutes fires up first go.

Regards,
Daniel

If you're going to blindly replace 3 sensor (and I understand the frustration of not having an isolating test) then I would do it sequentially; a week at a time. (here in the US, normally you cannot return electronic parts that have been used).

CTS first week, MAP the 2nd week, Air temp the 3rd week (in order of the likeliest suspect to the least likely) ...or find a (good) friend with a '13 or '14 TE, TXC (or maybe TC??) 250/310

good luck.

 

[dappleby]

If you're going to blindly replace 3 sensor (and I understand the frustration of not having an isolating test) then I would do it sequentially; a week at a time. (here in the US, normally you cannot return electronic parts that have been used).

CTS first week, MAP the 2nd week, Air temp the 3rd week (in order of the likeliest suspect to the least likely) ...or find a (good) friend with a '13 or '14 TE, TXC (or maybe TC??) 250/310

good luck.

That and from an economical stand point it's cheaper to buy all 3 sensors than 2 hours of dealer labour ( at least that's case here in Australia). The dealer's in my region are a bit useless so I am forced to diagnose myself. Without a service tool it's trial and error..

 

[Trenchcoat85]

MZee- I got a short, simple test for you to do: next time you get the symptoms, crack your gas cap. also, pls report back on all test and observations you do.

 

[MZee]

Hi MZee,

So you don't get any of the symptoms below 6000ft? My '14 also has the same symptoms but I am not riding anywhere near 6000ft. Got a map, water and air temp sensor on the way. Going to replacing them. I too replaced the plug and checked the value clearances (but it made no change). If the sensors don't yield anything ill look at injector and or fuel pump etc.

Mine runs smooth with cold. Idle is fine and no popping. Once it's gets hot it then starts to idle hunt and pop on decel. Can be also hard to start immediately after stalled but if i wait a few minutes fires up first go.

Regards,
Daniel

Daniel, My bike always has the lumpy erratic idle, hot or cold, High or low elevation. The decel popping happens much more at higher elevations .

 

[MZee]

yeah- that timing change, with the rotor key getting sheared, would be huge. (everybody else: this is from the other thread)

I don't know if you can see it by inspection or hafta remove the rotor... but at least put a socket on the nut. (maybe someone that has experienced this will chime in)

I'm wondering if the manifold air pressure sensor (aka "atmospheric" sensor, which is a terrible name) might be bad??? or if the port to the outside air (???) is clogged.

I have heard that a bad cylinder temp sensor will cause havoc

Are there simple electrical tests one can do to check these sensors? (The 2012 work shop manual I have checked does not cover testing of the sensors. But I believe '12 is a different brand FI system.) Or must we replace them blindly and check for improvement?

 

[Trenchcoat85]

Are there simple electrical tests one can do to check these sensors? (The 2012 work shop manual I have checked does not cover testing of the sensors. But I believe '12 is a different brand FI system.) Or must we replace them blindly and check for improvement?

test: not that I know of- but I bet there is. However, replace the CTS first ($15? call BMP in West Oregon); it's caused a lot of issues with the blackhead x-lites.

homemade test: if you want, try this: all 3 of these sensor might work on resistance. if you read zero or infinite ohms, it's probably a bad sensor. if you mildly heat the temp sensor and the resistance doesn't change- probably bad. on the MAP, if you could successfully suck or blow (hah) to get a pressure differential, the resistance should change- if doesn't, it's probably bad. again, IF they're based on resistance.

if they're based on voltage (peltier or seebeck effect or piezoelectric maybe) it's probably beyond a diy meter.

btw, use the '13 workshop manual, it's the one for the '14. The '11, '12 blackheads are different electrically from the redheads.

don't forget to open the gas cap next time it starts popping (and report back).

 

[Johnrg]

This is how my bike popped at elevation. Ouray from Gevernor Basin ... from 7 minutes on coming down you can here the popping. Was Map 3 at maybe 9500 feet of elevation. Next trip had the PCV and cleans it right up.

View: https://youtu.be/LvFX5g1hRhs

 

[Trenchcoat85]

This is how my bike popped at elevation. Ouray from Gevernor Basin ... from 7 minutes on coming down you can here the popping. Was Map 3 at maybe 9500 feet of elevation. Next trip had the PCV and cleans it right up.

View: https://youtu.be/LvFX5g1hRhs

sounds pretty normal.

 

[LAHuskyrider]

Last year I unknowingly sprung a radiator leak during a dual-sport event on my '13 TE310R. It got pretty hot but I caught it in time to add water and limp it back to the truck. Once I fixed the leak, it was fueling poorly and popping a lot. Per suggestion of Jay at Hall's, I replaced the water temp sensor and all is good.

 

[Dangermouse449]

That and from an economical stand point it's cheaper to buy all 3 sensors than 2 hours of dealer labour ( at least that's case here in Australia). The dealer's in my region are a bit useless so I am forced to diagnose myself. Without a service tool it's trial and error..

Where are you located. I know Toowoomba Bikes and Bits still have their old Husqvarna test gear