2014 TE310 Bad ECU?

[jxs2151]

Very long story with lots of troubleshooting. I'd appreciate any help as I am at wits end.

Bought the bike used from a dealer. It already had the powerup done, not sure about the map. Always ran great cold but never ran right when hot, boggy down low and not snappy at all. If it got really hot it would sputter. Lots of popping on decel when hot. It was simply a different bike when run hard. Plug always looked fine. Replaced water temp sensor.

Took the bike to CO around 10,000 ft. Started and let idle to adjust itself. First ride it acted like it always did - when hot it lost power and was boggy at low RPM's but still rideable. The next day we rode *hard* and the bike was unrideable, barely running. Took the dirt road into Gunnison in hopes of finding a Husky mech. He didn't work Mondays so I limped back to camp. Bike was running hot and coolant was low after filling it that morning.

Tank off, checking cooling system. Not sure if bike runs hot and causes issue or bike is lean and causing overheat. Tank back on, won't start...no spark at all. Fiddle, play and nothing. Spare bike.

Get home to Maryland and mess with kill switch, bike starts. Start troubleshooting cooling system, coolant bubbling out with rad cap off. Cool it off, coolant flow now. Replace defective fan temp sensor.

Back to working on the bike, Start it up to check coolant flow. Turn it off, an hour later no spark.

Checked kill switch, open circuit, closed when pushed. Check kill switch wiring all the way to ECU, no shorts to ground. Check fuse with multimeter, swap fuses, nothing. Check resistance of primary coil, within spec. No voltage to coil when cranking. Fully charged battery. Checked kill switch, checked kill switch.

Check all wiring, no shorts and no frame rubs.

Checked pulsar/pickup coil resistance - 164 ohms. Stator resistance between all three wires - .7 ohms. Seeing voltage on DMM from pickup coil when cranking.

No Huksy dealer within hundreds of miles. The only one "*may* be able to get to it sometime in October."

 

[jxs2151]

Went back after posting and checked the coil - ~.1-.2 ohms between the two leads. Given the resistance of the MM leads, that's within spec.

Primary winding resistance: 0,09 ±15% at 20°C

The manual then says:

"Secondary winding resistance: Open circuit"

I measured between one of the leads to the plug end and get 5.6k ohms. The other lead to the plug end gets 5.6k ohms.

What the heck is "Terminal cap resistance: 5,7 K ±20% at 20°C"? That is roughly the measurement above.

 

[jxs2151]

Is there supposed to be voltage across the primary (plug) coil leads when cranking?

 

[Dangermouse449]

You should have some sort measurable signal, otherwise the coil won't fire.

 

[jxs2151]

Perhaps I should have worded that differently?:

Should I be measuring a voltage between the two leads or from each lead to ground?

 

[jxs2151]

Weird thing today: Standing near the bike after doing some troubleshooting and hear the Power Relay clicking.

Nothing is being done to the bike and the stator and pulsar coil are disconnected as is the primary plug coil.

 

[Trenchcoat85]

Weird thing today: Standing near the bike after doing some troubleshooting and hear the Power Relay clicking.

Nothing is being done to the bike and the stator and pulsar coil are disconnected as is the primary plug coil.

You didn't by any chance have it on a battery charger, did you? There have been reports of the keyless huskys power relays or fuel pump relays cycling while the bike is on the charger.

 

[jxs2151]

Indeed I did, had it on the battery tender. I checked the voltage soon after disconnecting it from the charger and noted that it was in the 14's and slowly returning to the 12's. Maybe that causes the relays to fire for some reason.


Thanks for taking the time. I thought I had another path to troubleshoot.

 

[jxs2151]

Also, hooked up an analog multimeter today and got 2v AC from the pulsar/pickup coil while cranking. Anyone know what that value should be?

 

[Trenchcoat85]

Indeed I did, had it on the battery tender. I checked the voltage soon after disconnecting it from the charger and noted that it was in the 14's and slowly returning to the 12's. Maybe that causes the relays to fire for some reason.


Thanks for taking the time. I thought I had another path to troubleshoot.

I think what happens is the ECU detects a certain voltage level (say, 12.9v) and thinks the bike is making electricity... so it turns the relay on. Just guessing tho. but since you don't have a key, the ecu has got to use some criteria to decide that the bike's stuff needs to be turned on. hell, maybe it's not the ecu, but just a kind of simple level detector (Zenor diode?). I dunno.

edit: it looks like it may be the regulator that does this function. weird. post #21 of this same thread
http://www.cafehusky.com/threads/2014-te310-bad-ecu.85038/page-2#post-592700

Also, hooked up a analog multimeter today and got 2v AC from the pulsar/pickup coil while cranking. Anyone know what that value should be?

actually, 2VAC sounds kinda high to me- I would've guessed 0.8vac or something similar. Betcha you're good though.

Do you have a real good multimeter or something? the reason I ask is that I have about 10 of the harbor freight type meters... they're okay, but they have a sampling rate of about 1/2 to 1Hz. I see errors all the time because of the low rate.

edit: oops- I see you had an analog meter... never mind. I was refering to my cheezy digital meters.

 

[Trenchcoat85]

BTW, it seems to me that you should 12 volts on the primary windings of the ignition coil.

 

[jxs2151]

I think I have a bad ECU. I don't want to accept that but everything else checks okay.

 

[Trenchcoat85]

did you trace the white/red wire from the coil back to your ECU #18 connection? How about your (blue? black?) wire from the coil to ground?

 

[jxs2151]

Put the analog meter across the primary coil lead and got intermittent voltage, sometimes it would bump the meter and sometimes it would not when it came time for the firing cycle.

Any ideas?

 

[jxs2151]

Now I am at the point where the first firing point creates voltage to the coil but no subsequent firings do. If I let it rest a minute or two it will do the same thing - the first firing cycle produces voltage but none thereafter.

Is it possible the capacitor in the ECU is bad?

 

[jxs2151]

Weird, the part number for the ECU in my 2014 TE310R is for a 2012 TC205 - 8000H6637.

I hate this bike.

 

[Trenchcoat85]

Weird, the part number for the ECU in my 2014 TE310R is for a 2012 TC205 - 8000H6637.

I hate this bike.

that is not the part number for your ECU. actually, that is not a legit husky number afaik. your part number is #8538830 ($414.99). The 2013-14 TEs & TXC use the same ECU, which surprised me... they have different maps, so maybe the company is expecting the dealer to remap 'em. I'd expect the TC ecu to be pin-compatible but I wouldn't expect it to work on a TE. Your DC relay probably would never get turned on (horn, lights, etc) if the bike would even run. I would have to think about that for a bit.
[edit: not true? see post #21 of this same thread]


btw, I'm betting your ECU is fine.

you need to take a step back- you're all over the map here. relax... and breathe.

You messed with the kill switch... and suddenly the bike runs. but you're convinced that it's the ECU (the single most expensive component of the electrical system)

at the moment, I would be suspicious of the coil (part #8000H6570 $49.99) although it seems you've done the tests that you can. got a buddy with a '13 or '14? (I looked, and was surprised to find that the 449/511 coil was different- could just be the bolt-down feature. but I am pretty sure you could use a '12-'13 TC coil also for testing- but it has a different part #... no suppression resistor I'd bet). hell, maybe an auto mechanic could take a look at your coil and say something like: "yeah, every new VW in the world uses those- $18". It's happened many times before.

Also, I'm a little leery of the claim that all the wiring was inspected. why don't you take a very hard look at it again. go slow. glass of wine, a good flashlight, soft music... hell, think of it as a date.

I am not sure that your over-heating issue and poor running engine are related... but maybe. (BTW, coils used to be very heat-sensitive; but not much nowadays)

my '14 runs insanely crisp and sharp. once you get your bike running, let's take a look at the mods (intake fully uncorked? sounds like the un-modded velocity stack or stock cage is still in there). we could also be dealing with a clogged injector. anyhoooo, lets get the bike running first.

good luck.

ps- btw, most analog multi-meters can be zero'd out when measuring ohms. also, the needle wont react fast enough for the dc voltages on the coil during cranking... it'll just shake, probably.

pps- is your FI error light (where the key used to go) flashing when you're cranking or running? BTW, normally you should get a quick flash on it when you shutdown.

ppps- when you say "no spark" are you pulling the plug, putting the coil/cap on it (and grounding the plug very-very-very good) while cranking on the starter or kickstarter. please (please) tell me yes.

 

[jxs2151]

that is not the part number for your ECU. actually, that is not a legit husky number afaik. your part number is #8538830 ($414.99). The 2013-14 TEs & TXC use the same ECU, which surprised me... they have different maps, so maybe the company is expecting the dealer to remap 'em. I'd expect the TC ecu to be pin-compatible but I wouldn't expect it to work on a TE. Your DC relay probably would never get turned on (horn, lights, etc) if the bike would even run. I would have to think about that for a bit.

Thanks for sticking with me on this, I know you don't have to but, hey, it's been interesting.

The part # printed on the ECU I pulled from the bike is 8000H6337. That part number shows up here as a TC250 ECU:

http://www.husqyparts.com/en/model/2012/tc_250/oem/23267

The part # I have listed for a 2014 TE310R is indeed 8538830 but I am looking at an ECU with a VIN that matches my bike with a part # of 8000H6337 printed on it.

btw, I'm betting your ECU is fine.

you need to take a step back- you're all over the map here. relax... and breathe.

I can understand how this can look like there is a lot going on but I think I have been pretty methodical. I was an Avionics Tech on F/A-18's in the Marine Corps, formerly an RF engineer and an Extra class Ham Radio operator. I have some experience with wiring, electrics and electronics.

You messed with the kill switch... and suddenly the bike runs. but you're convinced that it's the ECU (the single most expensive component of the electrical system)

I eliminated the kill switch as a problem by completely ohming it and checking for shorts to ground. As a last step I unplugged the switch and still got the same results. It is more likely that me messing with the kill switch and the bike working again is a coincidence.

at the moment, I would be suspicious of the coil (part #8000H6570 $49.99) although it seems you've done the tests that you can. got a buddy with a '13 or '14? (I looked, and was surprised to find that the 449/511 coil was different- could just be the bolt-down feature. but I am pretty sure you could use a '12-'13 TC coil also for testing- but it has a different part #... no suppression resistor I'd bet). hell, maybe an auto mechanic could take a look at your coil and say something like: "yeah, every new VW in the world uses those- $18". It's happened many times before.

At one point I was convinced it was the nicely cheap coil. I ohmed it out to spec and unfortunately do not have any that I can use. I checked the Denso number to see if I could pick one up at the auto store but no luck.

Also, I'm a little leery of the claim that all the wiring was inspected. why don't you take a very hard look at it again. go slow. glass of wine, a good flashlight, soft music... hell, think of it as a date.

Checked for continuity and shorts. Inspected for rub points and even unwrapped a bit and visually inspected.

I am not sure that your over-heating issue and poor running engine are related... but maybe. (BTW, coils used to be very heat-sensitive; but not much nowadays)

my '14 runs insanely crisp and sharp. once you get your bike running, let's take a look at the mods (intake fully uncorked? sounds like the un-modded velocity stack or stock cage is still in there). we could also be dealing with a clogged injector. anyhoooo, lets get the bike running first.

When mine was running, it would act *exactly* like that...when cool or warm. I checked all the (physical) power-up mods and they have been done - stack, cage, cat removal, O2 plugged.

ps- btw, most analog multi-meters can be zero'd out when measuring ohms. also, the needle wont react fast enough for the dc voltages on the coil during cranking... it'll just shake, probably.

The analog meter jumps to about 6 volts. Sometimes yesterday it would jump every firing cycle. Now it jumps once and not any more. This matches the spark pattern I get, see below.

pps- is your FI error light (where the key used to go) flashing when you're cranking or running? BTW, normally you should get a quick flash on it when you shutdown.

No

ppps- when you say "no spark" are you pulling the plug, putting the coil/cap on it (and grounding the plug very-very-very good) while cranking on the starter or kickstarter. please (please) tell me yes.

Yes, exactly that method. I was getting no spark then an occasional spark. Once when I was getting repeated voltage to the coil and spark I re-assembled and it would not start. Took it apart again and am now getting a single voltage spike and a single spark.

I am going to check the voltage coming from the pulsar coil again to see if it matches the intermittency of the voltage going to the primary coil.[/quote]

 

[Huskynoobee]

It is/was a common mod to swap in a TC ECU and injector to add snap to them. Do you have any dealers near you with an HST? That would help to rule out the ECU. If not, call up Zip-Ty. He has a 310 and an HST to test it.

 

[jxs2151]

It is/was a common mod to swap in a TC ECU and injector to add snap to them. Do you have any dealers near you with an HST? That would help to rule out the ECU. If not, call up Zip-Ty. He has a 310 and an HST to test it.

I was thinking that also...until I saw a sticker on the ECU with a VIN matching my frame.

I do not have a nearby dealer that can deal with this model year bike. It seems like the bastard child Frankenstein of Huskys.

I should in fact give Zip-Ty a call.

Thanks for the thoughts.