12 Hole Injector Upgrade For Te250 / Te310

[mnb]

It's offered w/o the pipe for those that installed the pipe before the new injector was available.

 

[jimbee]

Hey'o - bought a 2011 TE250 a couple weeks ago. It was a Demo bike with 3 hours on it. Dealer says they had already installed the new 12 hole injector + CDI and removed the O2 sensor (still stock pipe but with insert and catalytic stuff removed). They claim to have NOT done powerup (I don't actually know what that involves) and that the 2 year warranty is still fine. After riding it around the neighborhood at the dealer, it didn't feel right and so they remapped it with iBeat (albeit with a guy who didn't really do a lot of mapping - regular guy was not there).

Because I bought the bike with the 12 hole injector and new CDI already installed, I can't compare before and after, but I have now been on two trail rides with a wide variety of terain (tight single track, hill climbs, logging roads, etc) and have some observations...

GOOD: This bike absolutly screams in the mid and top - it has much more power in these ranges than any other 250F I've ever ridden. I can grab a fist full of throttle mid way up a long hill climb and it just takes off like a much bigger bike!!

BAD: It is very hard to lug this bike along in the slow tight stuff. It just flames out at all the wrong times - especially in akward technical sections, but also just taking off from a stop. I like this bike for many reasons, but this is really frustrating!?

Reading here, it looks like this is rather common, but that some have found that the new injector and CDI cured the low end flame outs. Is there a pattern here that I am missing that connects those that have been succesful? I am a total neophite when it comes to playing with and understanding the effects of the CO2, TPS, and other EFI settings. I have a JD kit on order, but if the low end issues really can be tuned out with proper iBeat tinkering, I would prefer to start there before adding another variable with the JD kit.

What common thread ties those that have cured the low end issues that the rest of us can learn from!?

PS - First Post - thanks for the help and looking foward to contributing!

 

[Ex HVUK]

Hey'o - bought a 2011 TE250 a couple weeks ago. It was a Demo bike with 3 hours on it. Dealer says they had already installed the new 12 hole injector + CDI and removed the O2 sensor (still stock pipe but with insert and catalytic stuff removed). They claim to have NOT done powerup (I don't actually know what that involves) and that the 2 year warranty is still fine. After riding it around the neighborhood at the dealer, it didn't feel right and so they remapped it with iBeat (albeit with a guy who didn't really do a lot of mapping - regular guy was not there).

Because I bought the bike with the 12 hole injector and new CDI already installed, I can't compare before and after, but I have now been on two trail rides with a wide variety of terain (tight single track, hill climbs, logging roads, etc) and have some observations...

GOOD: This bike absolutly screams in the mid and top - it has much more power in these ranges than any other 250F I've ever ridden. I can grab a fist full of throttle mid way up a long hill climb and it just takes off like a much bigger bike!!

BAD: It is very hard to lug this bike along in the slow tight stuff. It just flames out at all the wrong times - especially in akward technical sections, but also just taking off from a stop. I like this bike for many reasons, but this is really frustrating!?

Reading here, it looks like this is rather common, but that some have found that the new injector and CDI cured the low end flame outs. Is there a pattern here that I am missing that connects those that have been succesful? I am a total neophite when it comes to playing with and understanding the effects of the CO2, TPS, and other EFI settings. I have a JD kit on order, but if the low end issues really can be tuned out with proper iBeat tinkering, I would prefer to start there before adding another variable with the JD kit.

What common thread ties those that have cured the low end issues that the rest of us can learn from!?

PS - First Post - thanks for the help and looking foward to contributing!

First check is that it definitely has the 12 port injector - it should be green coloured plastic, original injector is yellow. We've not heard of poor low speed running with the kit fitted so unless the fuelling has been set way out when they installed the injector and ECU then I'm not sure what else to suggest. There are pictures of the injectors further up this thread for reference.

FYI if they have taken out the O2 sensor then the bike is 'powered up'. The conversion involves plugging a resistor into the wiring loom where the O2 sensor was unplugged from.

Dave

 

[josh310]

i was also wondering if these throttle bodies on these bikes have mass air flow sensors. One of my friends rides a new kx450 and it has no spot for a o2 sensor but it has a maf in front of there throttle bodies and that bike runs really crisp and clean at all rpms. I am really disappointed in the fuel injection set up on these bikes from the factory.

 

[510 SM SC]

My dealer, KTM, HUSQVARNA, HUSABURG,GAS GAS etc. Called me, to ask if I could lend him my 4 port
injector nozzle to take to a NA KTM meeting ??? EPA.....

 

[510 SM SC]

Go play with your JD or PCV to think you can get it going close to where the Factory CH team has tuned the new ECU. The power band is smooth as silk, crisp and clean all the way through the ranges. I will be ridding while you all try to get it sorted out. My bike is now running perfect with the Full Leo, 12 Port and ECU. 2012 TXC like? It Grunts and Screams now... With out extra wires and all the BS.

# 510

 

[JasonfromMN]

Go play with your JD or PCV to think you can get it going close to where the Factory CH team has tuned the new ECU. The power band is smooth as silk, crisp and clean all the way through the ranges. I will be ridding while you all try to get it sorted out. My bike is now running perfect with the Full Leo, 12 Port and ECU. 2012 TXC like? It Grunts and Screams now... With out extra wires and all the BS.

# 510

Who are you even aiming this at? Post #102? He states he has the the 12 hole injector and CDI but probably means the ECU since the dealer installed it. Most of your posts regarding the injector are always just to be negative. The whole point of this forum and especially the threads on this issue are to help people get this sorted, not stick your "mines perfect cause I make $25/ hr and can afford whatever I want" into them. Sorry, not everyone's as well off as you.

Hey'o - bought a 2011 TE250 a couple weeks ago. It was a Demo bike with 3 hours on it. Dealer says they had already installed the new 12 hole injector + CDI and removed the O2 sensor (still stock pipe but with insert and catalytic stuff removed). They claim to have NOT done powerup (I don't actually know what that involves) and that the 2 year warranty is still fine. After riding it around the neighborhood at the dealer, it didn't feel right and so they remapped it with iBeat (albeit with a guy who didn't really do a lot of mapping - regular guy was not there).

Because I bought the bike with the 12 hole injector and new CDI already installed, I can't compare before and after, but I have now been on two trail rides with a wide variety of terain (tight single track, hill climbs, logging roads, etc) and have some observations...

GOOD: This bike absolutly screams in the mid and top - it has much more power in these ranges than any other 250F I've ever ridden. I can grab a fist full of throttle mid way up a long hill climb and it just takes off like a much bigger bike!!

BAD: It is very hard to lug this bike along in the slow tight stuff. It just flames out at all the wrong times - especially in akward technical sections, but also just taking off from a stop. I like this bike for many reasons, but this is really frustrating!?

Reading here, it looks like this is rather common, but that some have found that the new injector and CDI cured the low end flame outs. Is there a pattern here that I am missing that connects those that have been succesful? I am a total neophite when it comes to playing with and understanding the effects of the CO2, TPS, and other EFI settings. I have a JD kit on order, but if the low end issues really can be tuned out with proper iBeat tinkering, I would prefer to start there before adding another variable with the JD kit.

What common thread ties those that have cured the low end issues that the rest of us can learn from!?

PS - First Post - thanks for the help and looking foward to contributing!

To try to apply some constructive debate to this issue, you will not tune out the low end flame outs with ibeat unless your TPS is out of calibration or your throttle hard stop is set improper. I've spent several hours trying to do so. I bought the JD TUNER and was able to tune out the low end stumble in almost seconds. I've only had one go at it so im sure I'll get it even better with some more tinkering time weather permitted here. With that said, It doesn't mean my bottom end is supper strong suddenly, just that it is no longer stall prone but smooth followed by quite a good hit throughout the rest of the range. I believe the TPS and throttle stop adjustment also plays a big roll in how it behaves.

I'd take what 510 SM SC says with a grain of salt because you never know what situation/ trail/ terrain other people are riding in to produce the results they exclaim. I have a very specific test spot that has a very tight 1st gear like 90 degree corner that immediately leads into a uphill slope that I'm running 2nd gear around. Not to call him a liar though just that if I did not have that section I would be exclaiming the exact same results he does.

 

[jimbee]

Finally had time to spend in the garage on the weekend.

Yes, the injector is dark green, so i'm assuming I do have the 12 hole injector.

I spoke to JD and asked if the 12 hole would require different settings than the 4 hole. They said that they had just tuned a 2012, which supposedly has 12 hole, and that it worked great. Not sure if that means they used same or different settings.

In any case, I went ahead and installed the JD tuner. I only had time to warm it up for a few minutes and ride around the neighborhood, but it seemed to flame out even easier. So, time to get out on the trail and play with the tuning.

JasonfromMN: when trying to tune out the low end stumble, did you mostly play with the "idle circuit" (Blue/Green) or the "pilot jet" (Green)?

 

[510 SM SC]

Who are you even aiming this at? Post #102? He states he has the the 12 hole injector and CDI but probably means the ECU since the dealer installed it. Most of your posts regarding the injector are always just to be negative. The whole point of this forum and especially the threads on this issue are to help people get this sorted, not stick your "mines perfect cause I make $25/ hr and can afford whatever I want" into them. Sorry, not everyone's as well off as you.

To try to apply some constructive debate to this issue, you will not tune out the low end flame outs with ibeat unless your TPS is out of calibration or your throttle hard stop is set improper. I've spent several hours trying to do so. I bought the JD TUNER and was able to tune out the low end stumble in almost seconds. I've only had one go at it so im sure I'll get it even better with some more tinkering time weather permitted here. With that said, It doesn't mean my bottom end is supper strong suddenly, just that it is no longer stall prone but smooth followed by quite a good hit throughout the rest of the range. I believe the TPS and throttle stop adjustment also plays a big roll in how it behaves.

I'd take what 510 SM SC says with a grain of salt because you never know what situation/ trail/ terrain other people are riding in to produce the results they exclaim. I have a very specific test spot that has a very tight 1st gear like 90 degree corner that immediately leads into a uphill slope that I'm running 2nd gear around. Not to call him a liar though just that if I did not have that section I would be exclaiming the exact same results he does.

Jason, yes on the constructive debate. Yes my last post " I was Tooting My Horn" not directed at anyone, and yes I am very happy to be working hard to pay for my passion.

That said, nobody that installed the Husky Up grade has done a follow up report ??? So I thought I
would after an epic ride and a beer or two after. My thinking was " To offer info to all 250/310 buyers
to budget for this system because it works for the Factory CH team, on my bike and where I ride. "Plug and Play".

I turn 50 next week, have been riding 43 years now, Last 4 years Racing Supermoto on my 07 510 SMR
and 150R. This 11 250 was bought for an off season fun bike " cow trailing". BTW I am a Bad liar so I
try not to.....

Cheers

Rob

 

[Mikenc]

2011 TE310 - Installed the 12 point injector, race ecu, and Leo Vince (8000H7556). Not working out well from a few fronts 1. missing bracket 2. EFI problem

Missing Bracket
Once the dealer got the injector, ecu, and silencer installed they realized it did not come with the mounting bracket to attach the silencer to the bike. After the dealer called Husky and got absolutely no useful information on when they would deliver the bracket to complete the set - I ended calling Leo Vince and got them to send me the part at a cost of course. At this point, I have gotten no commitment from husky to deliver the bracket (will us it as a backup) or refund the amount I had to pay Leo Vince. I would expect better customer support especially at the cost off this set up.

EFI Problem
When starting the bike cold - holding the cold start lever the bike fires up but quickly looses RPM’s and starts to sputter and it is difficult to restart. Eventually, got it going and heated up. About 20 minutes into my ride the bike started to die out in slower second gear turns on Mx track. Once it died out it was hard to start. Seemed like every time the RPM’s dropped the bike started sputtering and died out. In order to ride the bike I turned the idle/air screw in – which increase the RPM’s to around 2800 – bike seemed to run fine if I did not let the idle go below 2600 to 2800.

The dealer has no idea on what is going on but is working very hard to figure it out. They believe there is a problem with the ECU and are ordering another one for me to try.

Any thoughts would be helpful. Hope to get it worked out – love riding this bike but have had more than my share of issues with this bike.

 

[JasonfromMN]

Finally had time to spend in the garage on the weekend.

Yes, the injector is dark green, so i'm assuming I do have the 12 hole injector.

I spoke to JD and asked if the 12 hole would require different settings than the 4 hole. They said that they had just tuned a 2012, which supposedly has 12 hole, and that it worked great. Not sure if that means they used same or different settings.

In any case, I went ahead and installed the JD tuner. I only had time to warm it up for a few minutes and ride around the neighborhood, but it seemed to flame out even easier. So, time to get out on the trail and play with the tuning.

JasonfromMN: when trying to tune out the low end stumble, did you mostly play with the "idle circuit" (Blue/Green) or the "pilot jet" (Green)?

I leaned out both quite a bit. Not sure of the numbers right now. I also noticed every time I hammered the throttle in second, it was right about at the yellow too. That one also got leaned out. I'll have more time with it this weekend. Make sure your TPS Is also calibrated.

Jason, yes on the constructive debate. Yes my last post " I was Tooting My Horn" not directed at anyone, and yes I am very happy to be working hard to pay for my passion.

That said, nobody that installed the Husky Up grade has done a follow up report ??? So I thought I
would after an epic ride and a beer or two after. My thinking was " To offer info to all 250/310 buyers
to budget for this system because it works for the Factory CH team, on my bike and where I ride. "Plug and Play".

I turn 50 next week, have been riding 43 years now, Last 4 years Racing Supermoto on my 07 510 SMR
and 150R. This 11 250 was bought for an off season fun bike " cow trailing". BTW I am a Bad liar so I
try not to.....

Cheers

Rob

Guess maybe we have different ways to reach a similar goal then. Anyway, happy birthday.

Mikenc, your EFI symptoms sound exactly like my first experience with the new injector which I believe was mostly due to an overly rich bottom end. My bike does not have the ECU and Leo though.

 

[510 SM SC]

2011 TE310 - Installed the 12 point injector, race ecu, and Leo Vince (8000H7556). Not working out well from a few fronts 1. missing bracket 2. EFI problem

Missing Bracket
Once the dealer got the injector, ecu, and silencer installed they realized it did not come with the mounting bracket to attach the silencer to the bike. After the dealer called Husky and got absolutely no useful information on when they would deliver the bracket to complete the set - I ended calling Leo Vince and got them to send me the part at a cost of course. At this point, I have gotten no commitment from husky to deliver the bracket (will us it as a backup) or refund the amount I had to pay Leo Vince. I would expect better customer support especially at the cost off this set up.

EFI Problem
When starting the bike cold - holding the cold start lever the bike fires up but quickly looses RPM’s and starts to sputter and it is difficult to restart. Eventually, got it going and heated up. About 20 minutes into my ride the bike started to die out in slower second gear turns on Mx track. Once it died out it was hard to start. Seemed like every time the RPM’s dropped the bike started sputtering and died out. In order to ride the bike I turned the idle/air screw in – which increase the RPM’s to around 2800 – bike seemed to run fine if I did not let the idle go below 2600 to 2800.

The dealer has no idea on what is going on but is working very hard to figure it out. They believe there is a problem with the ECU and are ordering another one for me to try.

Any thoughts would be helpful. Hope to get it worked out – love riding this bike but have had more than my share of issues with this bike.

Bracket
Bummer, was it the carbon bracket? Leo Vince supports there product and are good at it. I always check the contents before installation. This is what I do for a living in another field. Good luck with Husky ?

EFI problem
Check boots for air leaks? It is tight and a pain to swap the nozzle. I installed the 2010 Leo "Full Ti system" ( header and race ecu) and had the dealer reset the TPS as per instructions on I Beat after I got it, almost a year ago. I plan to find and scan that document for us all to share. Then did the 12 port/ecu upgrade a few weeks ago. Seams like people that bought the Muffler only or tried something different did not get the same results I did ???(ECU tuned to "Full Leo Only") My Dealer is very cool, but my bike has been a test bike, at my cost to make it run right. That said, I think they will give me some I-Beat time to see where we are and share. My Idle is at 1950-2000 when warmed up. Runs smooth as silk from there to 13000, and I have the 2 factory Maps (Hard and Slick) closed loops to play with on my " Fun Bike"

Good Times

# 510

 

[Mikenc]

510 SM SC it would be great if you could post the instructions - i am sure mine dine not come with any. My dealer orderd a new ECU (specific for my Leo Vince kit) and in the interim he sent me a 2012 TXC ECU. After install the bike fired right up, idled well, and seem to perform well. I am riding today so i will give it a good test. Dealer been providing great support and believes the initial ECU has some code problems.

 

[eramsey]

New special parts upgrade released by the factory for 2010/2011 TE250 and TE310 which according to the information provided will improve the power of the engine at low and medium speeds and ensure a significant increase in performance and handling in all driving conditions.

The kit consists of a new injector with 12 holes (I guess for better fuel atomisation) along with a remapped ECU to match and if needed the Leo Vince Ti exhaust system.

Parts Information:

We haven't tested it ourselves yet but I'm told it is a dramatic improvement in terms of bottom end and mid range power and is being used on Meos 310 amongst others.

Dave

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My question for the above, is the ECU mapping the same in each kit for the 310. 8000H7556 is kit with a silencer and 8000H7555 is a kit with pipe and silencer. So I am assuming the ECU mapping is the same (incl 8000H7557) for all 3 kit options and the difference in whether you have a kit pipe or not will not offset the new kit mapping with injector. In other words as long as I have a muffler that breathes better or the header muffler combination from the previous special parts kit it should work. I hope that means I can use any aftermarket muffler and header. I would like to use an FMF Q4 or possibly an Akrapovic set with the 8000H7557 kit. Do you think this will work ? Or am I stuck with the special parts Leo Vince. I am considering this for a 2012 TE310 and wondering the options on mufflers etc. The Leo Vince muffler is nice but am not a fan of the header and rectangle bump. Akprapovic's look much more attractive if I was to add a header combination.

 

[Ex HVUK]

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My question for the above, is the ECU mapping the same in each kit for the 310. 8000H7556 is kit with a silencer and 8000H7555 is a kit with pipe and silencer. So I am assuming the ECU mapping is the same (incl 8000H7557) for all 3 kit options and the difference in whether you have a kit pipe or not will not offset the new kit mapping with injector. In other words as long as I have a muffler that breathes better or the header muffler combination from the previous special parts kit it should work. I hope that means I can use any aftermarket muffler and header. I would like to use an FMF Q4 or possibly an Akrapovic set with the 8000H7557 kit. Do you think this will work ? Or am I stuck with the special parts Leo Vince. I am considering this for a 2012 TE310 and wondering the options on mufflers etc. The Leo Vince muffler is nice but am not a fan of the header and rectangle bump. Akprapovic's look much more attractive if I was to add a header combination.

The ECU mapping will have been developed to work best with the Leo Vince pipes. We've never tested the 310 with anything other than the Leo so I can't give a definitive answer to your post. I can say however that we dyno tested a 2010 TE250 with Leo, Akro and std pipe when the Leo's first came available and it was possible to fine time the fuelling with Ibeat to suit all three pipes. The air/fuel ratio was ideal all through the rev range on the Leo but the Akro was also very close and made the same power so I wouldnt expect you to have any particular issues. A bit of time spent on the dyno would confirm this of course.

Dave

 

[Bobby]

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My question for the above, is the ECU mapping the same in each kit for the 310. 8000H7556 is kit with a silencer and 8000H7555 is a kit with pipe and silencer. So I am assuming the ECU mapping is the same (incl 8000H7557) for all 3 kit options and the difference in whether you have a kit pipe or not will not offset the new kit mapping with injector. In other words as long as I have a muffler that breathes better or the header muffler combination from the previous special parts kit it should work. I hope that means I can use any aftermarket muffler and header. I would like to use an FMF Q4 or possibly an Akrapovic set with the 8000H7557 kit. Do you think this will work ? Or am I stuck with the special parts Leo Vince. I am considering this for a 2012 TE310 and wondering the options on mufflers etc. The Leo Vince muffler is nice but am not a fan of the header and rectangle bump. Akprapovic's look much more attractive if I was to add a header combination.

Doing this exact thing on two separate 2011 TE250's tomorrow, one with full Ti Akra system and the other the HSQ LeoV system. The Akra bike will be ridden all weekend and we'll have a good before and after ECU/12p injector comparison. It's always had a full Akra from day one and it's always ran very well from day one, but gonna test it out myself to see just how much improvement it's going to be. I will say the Factory aftersales LeoV has some perforated baffling in it where as the Akra does not, if anything I would suspect the Akra to be capable of more flow, but that doesn't necessarily mean more HP over the LV.

 

[eramsey]

Bobby keep us informed on the outcome. Thanks.

 

[Bobby]

Bobby keep us informed on the outcome. Thanks.

Well both are in. One was a customers bike who went with the full HSQ shebang of Full LV with 12p and ECU on his 2011 TE250 and I installed a 12p/ecu on my girlfriend's '11 TE250 which already has the full Ti Akra. I'm pretty sure I felt some improvement on her bike, but not OMG this was worth $380 retail feeling. I told her something was new on her bike tonight but wouldn't disclose what, we'll see what she has to say when we hit the trail tomorrow as she's been on it 3 of the past 4 weekends without the 12p/ecu, so she has a fresh memory of what it was like power-wise.

Hopefully the other gent will get to ride his this weekend and give me some feedback, but I'm certain he's going to feel some improvement as he got the full HSQ LV system with fancy headpipe and no restrictor in exhaust.

 

[jimbee]

I think 100 on all 3 CO's is going to be close...
Dave, do you know what ball park idle that the bikes like best? I think I am idling around 2200 and I need to set that down a little. My TPS reading is 1021.

+1 Also working to dial in the new injector and ECU and hoping to hear where everyone has ended up with thier settings.

Moved all CO's back to 100 and this seems to be pretty close, but now will fine tune with JD on the trail.

Now working on TPS. I found it at 102.0, but don't know it that is stock setting? I screwed in the idle stop and reset TPS to 101.5 because others here had said this worked, but I now can't get my idle to go below 2,500 even with unscrewing the idle air mix screw way out (+4 turns) - at 3 turns out the idle rpm is closer to 3,000. I'm thinking that while the 101.5% WOT TPS setting might work to fix the low end bog in the stock ECU, that perhaps the new race ECU may not need to have the TPS tweaked? This begs the question, what is the factory recomended WOT% TPS setting for the new race ECU mapping (or even the stock one). I've combed through +600 pages of the two different factory manuals and this isn't specified anywhere that I can see.

Dave: how do you set up the TPS on the bikes you install the new injector and ecu on and where does the idle rpm end up?

Thanks much!

 

[raisrx251]

+1 Also working to dial in the new injector and ECU and hoping to hear where everyone has ended up with thier settings.

Moved all CO's back to 100 and this seems to be pretty close, but now will fine tune with JD on the trail.

Now working on TPS. I found it at 102.0, but don't know it that is stock setting? I screwed in the idle stop and reset TPS to 101.5 because others here had said this worked, but I now can't get my idle to go below 2,500 even with unscrewing the idle air mix screw way out (+4 turns) - at 3 turns out the idle rpm is closer to 3,000. I'm thinking that while the 101.5% WOT TPS setting might work to fix the low end bog in the stock ECU, that perhaps the new race ECU may not need to have the TPS tweaked? This begs the question, what is the factory recomended WOT% TPS setting for the new race ECU mapping (or even the stock one). I've combed through +600 pages of the two different factory manuals and this isn't specified anywhere that I can see.

Dave: how do you set up the TPS on the bikes you install the new injector and ecu on and where does the idle rpm end up?

Thanks much!

The idle air mix screw (the one with the spring loaded philip screw) is not really a way to set your idle. The one with the nut that your turning in to adjust TPS does this primarily. Technically it does effect idle but it does not change it that much. From what I can tell it is basically a enricher for off idle on these bikes, in makes it richer if I remember right. Someone else can explain as it has been a while since I studied all of this. A stock TXC 310 I messed with was factory set to 97MV when read with Ibeat, and when I read it the reading was 100.