I don't see sound limits as over regulation - that is common sense regulation with an obvious and direct tie to both safety and longevity/protection of the sport. I don't mean any offense, but your reply is the easy way out of a problem - just tuck our head in the sand and ignore it. It IS a problem and industry and the AMA is doing nothing. You can blame the four stroke if you want, but sound is our number one enemy and noone is doing a damned thing about it. Every single year, the ratio of 4S:2S grows and the access to loud pipes grows as well. The average rider is simply ignorant that sound closes trails (even tracks). We want to get out in front of the regulation so we as enthusiasts can control it before it is mandated by guys in ties. All the major pipe makers could crank out 88 dB pipes RIGHT NOW...but they don't. Why? Because the market likes loud pipes...because some kid on a podium is sporting his Monster Energy, flat brimmed hat, and a 116 dB pipe - it's all about the money. I think the vast majority of folks here, at Thumpertalk, KTMTalk etc - the folks that care about the sport do realize that. The problem is that they represent a minority in the sport and the "average" guy doesn't give a flying flip about the impact of running a 100+ dB pipe.
I agree. Though I loath government regulation. If the AMA regulated noise, the manufacturers would respond and low and behold pipes would get quieter. It would be a win-win for everyone, because that tech would trickle down to the everyday woods rider. I want that tech.
Mike - I am not making demands - simple trying to raise awareness to the fact that this impacts us all. I have given more than the average Joe for this country in blood, sweat, and tears...and to be frank am pretty offended by your comment. If you want to tell me where to go, I can advise those that don't like any regulation to move to Somalia. There has been zero centralized government for over 20 years. Let me know how that works out for you. Government is not some enemy that the vocal right wants us to think. I do agree that they have made some uber-silly decisions and over legislate based mostly on ignorance. My whole point is that if we DONT want ridiculous legislation, then WE need to drive the solution and not sit back on our collective asses waiting for the trail fairy to create riding opportunities. In my lifetime, this sport has come and almost gone - it's all about sound. As the public moved outward, our "rural" riding spots became a nuisance and are voted out of existence by our neighbors. This is about US not elected officials.
My feelings on the issue. There's no need to blast exhaust tones to anyone else trying to enjoy themselves. Nine times out of ten, you're not gaining anything anyway.
Nice quote I may want to use that occasionally. There are a lot of loud things in the world and if it bothers you, wear hearing protection. Why should we start banning something because someone is to lazy to wear hearing protection. Anyone like to shoot?... I wear hearing protection, because it's loud. Geeze it's just earplugs people.
I completely agree with you right here! WE need to DRIVE the AMA and other organizations to internally limit noise at their events NOT wait for the government trail fairy to regulate it for us. I really am just debating here I promise to not be upset or judgmental this is a very, very good debate on a very important topic. Other people's right to have ear damaging pipes ends at my earlobe. If you are damaging your own hearing you are damaging mine. I just believe we should force manufactures to resolve this through the all mighty dollar not through legislation. Very good topic here.
How many greenies do you really think are attending Supercross events? If you don't like noise, you can watch it on tv in your living room and turn off the sound.
I'm not sure it's nearly a problem at the track event as much as outside of the event. I know that when I work the races, every once and awhile we will get someone obnoxiously loud, but it's not really a problem. Out in the desert here, there are other people out camping, bicycling, photographing, etc. and such and they don't want to hear the annoyance 25 miles away, and it's not right to ask them to wear ear plugs.
Before any further restrictions are placed on off-road riders it needs to be specifically defined what will be gained in return. By failing to organize and having a unified front, the opposition will nibble away at our rights until we are left with nothing. We should get guaranteed expansion of lands available for riding in return for any concessions on exhaust noise.
We are never going to get expanded access. The best we can ever hope for is to retain what we have. We COULD however, make significant headway with access via new technology - ie e-bikes. One would be hard pressed to allow equestrian use on a trail and prohibit and e-bike. Zero noise and zero emissions with near zero trail impact. Equestrian has a unified front and their image is wholesome, family, and eco friendly - the latter is a total farce but it IS the impression. I would go so far to say that anywhere bikes are allowed e-bikes should have access. An e-bike with trials tires is going to have the same long-term trail impact as any modern full suspension MTB. The e-bike thing is NOT that far off. A few more years of advanced cell types, especially batteries that can be poured into the frames of bikes and we may have a very viable sport. I would blow $10K on a e-bike right now if I had access to 1/2 the MTB trails near my house. Heck, within one hour of my house, I have enough MTB singletrack to keep me busy all year. If I want to ride my Jusky, I have to drive 6 hours for legal ST... The common thread here is noise... It didn't used to be this way. As a kid, we had all sorts of legal ST just a stone's throw away. As people spread, the legit riding places vanished due to both noise and a lack of legal protection for landowners. That is another aspect that equestrian has us beat all the hell on - for instance in Missouri, land and event owners cannot be sued for accidents related to equestrian activities - it is a state law. How did they do that? A unified front...better image... We have neither.
That's exactly how you lose. The greenies don't care if you retain what you have, and why should you give up something without gaining something in return?
I am not sure how to really answer your question. We are bleeding acres day by day...in order to stop the bleeding we need to apply direct pressure. If we fail to do so, government will come in and cut our appendage off and throw a tourniquet on. To them, the results are the same. If we continue down this path, our elected officials will simply step in and ban ALL motorized access from public lands - period. End of sport. Think that is far fetched? Think again... There is a very well funded, centralized, and clean-cut effort to abolish us from all public lands - USFS, BLM...ALL state and government land. The vast majority of this effort is funded and supported by average Americans that dont want to hear us. Hikers, bikers, horseback riders...it is a pyramid of purity and we fall down near the bottom - just above quads and Jeeps. So how about we get off the theoretical high horse and actually take action that fixes things instead of complaining about the hand which we were dealt? It is much easier for a Congressman of any party to vote us off public lands to secure a long-term presence in DC. We are a small and heavily segregated community with zero voice. If the AMA spent 1/2 what they do fighting helmet laws on trail access, this wouldnt be an issue...but it is...and they dont.
After going to Long Beach Grand Prix on Sunday and listening to my ears bleed, I have a new respect for "loud." Bikes are NOTHING compared to Indy cars. And a thumper at its very loudest is like soft sweet music compared to those uncorked Cadillac V8s. I thought about ear plugs, but decided against them since my tinnitis wasn't bothering me at all during the racing. Oh yea. Now that was loud redefined!
Ummm, how about being at the burnout as a top fuel dragster or funny car heats those big meats? Doesn't matter how much hearing protection you have because the sonic pressure (even at idle) is strong enough that it literally reverberates in your body. And the nitro makes your eyes water and your chest burn, and then little bits of rubber get all over your clothes and skin. They should make those hooligans use mufflers, bio-fuels, and of course the proper smog equipment to prevent those noxious fumes from contributing to "global climate change". Then after the races every little scrap of balled up rubber needs to be cleaned up, dropped into a biohazard bag, and sent to a place where they can reborn as comfy cushions for electric cars. Although the threats to our fun are real, they've been there for decades. Hell it's a bad idea to let your cattle graze on public lands, since the BLM can just decide to take over anything they want, steal your cattle, smack your family around, and tell anybody that wants to stand with you to "Order body bags". Plurocrats in DC are embracing the "progressive agenda" to stay in office and curry favor. Funny thing is that the USSR was into being "progressive" for some time to create a beautiful utopia through heavy handed govt regulation, beurocracy, and one sided propaganda. That was long before the nut jobs here decided to give it a whirl. How'd that turn out for the Soviets again?
