TE310R Oil Drain Plug Question

[Nick McCabe]

I'm trying to get an understanding of what the hose that hook to the oil drain plug is being used for. I attached the diagram that shows the hose layout. My understanding is the head ventilation hose (#6) attaches to a "manifold" in the frame where there is also a hose going to the airbox (also #6) and then the hose to the oil drain plug (#2). The airbox hose allows clean air to flow into the manifold and into the head. If the head ventilates positively into the manifold, the oil that may be in that air flows downward and returns to the crankcase via hose 6 (fastened to the oil drain plug).

My alternative theory is that the hose from the drain plug allows blowby to travel into the frame/manifold and return to the engine via the hose that hooks onto the head. The airbox hose serves to neutralize air pressure.

In the TC model, the airbox hose is eliminated so there is the hose that hooks to the head and a second hose that goes somewhere else, not to the oil drain plug, since a traditional style is used in this model.

Why is this hose design done in such a quirky and potentialy disasterous manner? Why could the hose not be hooked into another location in the crankcase what would not cause a loss of oil if detached? It seems there must be a reason to hook it to this location or the engineers would not have done it, certainly not after they paid dealers to replace engines under warranty that failed to due the poor design. Does anyone have a good understanding of this? Thanks in advance.

Nick

 

[Nick McCabe]

Also, has anyone installed the Zipty kit and had issues with the new drain plug threading in properly?

 

[reveille]

Also, has anyone installed the Zipty kit and had issues with the new drain plug threading in properly?

Yes I installed my kit with no issues. It is performing as designed. The hose hanging down low is a ticking time bomb and was a scary OEM design.

 

[Johnrg]

Only issue I can see threading a plug on the sump is it's shoulders push into the cylindrical screen. I installed my screen on in both directions and one side is slightly snugger than the other so I could see some plugs may simply hang up/resist while starting to thread. Why the oem method was a bitch leaving the hose loosely attached. Probably best to get that filter fully pushed into the sump first so it doesn't interfere with initial threading. If the ZT replacement is snugger as Tinken had mentioned that may be all this is. Don't have the kit myself...

 

[Nick McCabe]

Is the screen/filter that installs at the plug only needed to filter the return oil? In other words, when the return hose is moved, scan the screen be eliminated? It seems like there would no longer be flow through it after the kit is installed.

 

[Par4]

Is the screen/filter that installs at the plug only needed to filter the return oil? In other words, when the return hose is moved, scan the screen be eliminated? It seems like there would no longer be flow through it after the kit is installed.

I know that screen remains on the 250, so my guess is the screen has to stay. It may be the oil pump pickup screen? Not sure.

 

[Johnrg]

If you look at the engine castings in the service or parts diagram you will see the oil pump pickup is at the other end of the screen so it is screening the sump oil. It is not screening anything coming down the breather hose though. If a bike sits in cold and wet winters after a few years I can forsee rust and debris heading down that tube and into the oil flow unimpeded.

 

[Nick McCabe]

The difference in OEM set up vs Zipty kit is that the Zipty kit dumps into the air side of the crankcase which is theoretically under positive pressure because of blowby. The OEM set up uses the oil in the sump as a pressure break, like a P trap in plumbing. That would allow the oil to return without fighting the pressure of the crankcase. Probably why the engineers went the route they did instead of doing something similar to the ZT kit. I ordered mine nonetheless, if seems to be a proven product and nothing could be worse than the way it is now.

 

[Tinken]

If you look at the engine castings in the service or parts diagram you will see the oil pump pickup is at the other end of the screen so it is screening the sump oil. It is not screening anything coming down the breather hose though. If a bike sits in cold and wet winters after a few years I can forsee rust and debris heading down that tube and into the oil flow unimpeded.

http://www.cafehusky.com/threads/09-my2010-tc-250-rust-particle-entry-into-tappet-cover.41491/

Another really good reason to remove the bottom oil feed line. Rust from the oem breather tank will flow directly into the oil pump. Most of the debris will be caught in the filter, especially using a SS filter, I'd prefer to pre-filter most of the bigger chunks out before feeding them to the oil pump.

 

[Nick McCabe]

Thats scary, makes you wonder if a screen type fuel filter should go on that line.

 

[Nick McCabe]

Like this

 

[Tinken]

The prefilter and a stainless steel filter will take that debris out.

 

[Nick McCabe]

I was referring to the comment about rust migrating back to the head. There is no filtration to prevent the cam damage mentioned, correct?

The prefilter and a stainless steel filter will take that debris out.

 

[Tinken]

On that particular TC model, the oil flow back is directly to the head and not to the oil sump where it can be filtered. I do feel some sort of oil drain back filter may be advised, I will look into this and see what can be added.

 

[Nick McCabe]

I think you are right about the prefilter and SS filter taking care of the debris in the sump drain back. The line running from the head is probably unlikely to get any flow back due to the sloping of the breather tank. The intention is not for oil to flow back through that line. Regardless, the risk is not made worse by the kit. Just another potentially bad OEM design.

 

[Johnrg]

Here is one...

Though looks like screws on like cap.... Hmmm... Version 2 ZT Kit includes new piggyback inline filter. Simply unscrew and clean filter and reinstall ;-)



Peterson Rock Stoppers...

 

[Tinken]

I wouldn't put one of those fuel filters on. We are actually in the process of manufacturing a whole new state of the art line of filtration products. I can make one that will remove the debris and not risk backup.

 

[Nick McCabe]

I wouldn't put one of those fuel filters on. We are actually in the process of manufacturing a whole new state of the art line of filtration products. I can make one that will remove the debris and not risk backup.

Good call, these look too restrictive to flow oil without alot of pressure behind it.

 

[Nick McCabe]

Sure would be nice if they just made the breather tank alluminum or some other rust free metal, then this would be a nonissue.

 

[Tinken]

This is why I made my breather tanks out of a one piece billet. I couldn't risk debris from oxidation or welding.