Need help - 1986 500XC

[Michael Bucher]

My neighbor gave me a 1986 Husky 500XC. Got bike running after 13 yrs of sitting cold. Changed all fluids, rejetted for Phoenix (40mm Mikuni), fresh gas, new air filter, new plug (got spark), new reeds and new kill switch. Problem is we can't get it started by kicking when cold. It can be pull started cold. It can be kicked over when hot...sometimes.....easier to roll down a hill and bump start. Does anyone have any ideas to make this thing easier to kick over? I kick the crap out of it but get nothing. Appreciate any help..
Thanks
Mike

 

[fran...k.]

I will try and help you some of this will be off the wall and some will perhaps be of some use.

First thing is to find someone that has a very similar one and see if they can kick start yours. I have not had good experience with those water cooled 500 bikes. I don't know what or why it is but I have both entered and promoted amateur hillclimb events and have a very good idea of how honda and kawasaki bikes in this class start. Yes lately some of the guys have modified them to the extent hey come down wih batteries and electric starters even those there is a point I guess.

There most likely are numerous ways to install a compression release. This is standard in an awful lot of chainsaws over 50cc now. One rather nice way I have seen on here puts the compression release into the side of the head and a hole into the squish area connects to the device. Chances are I will try this at some point.

There are certain devices at fitness places that can be used to work on the muscle groups needed. There is certainly a knack to kicking somewhat back as well as down. Standing on something about a foot high, kicking with the left leg off the bike, meaning right foot on the stand, tie down the suspention, no center stand on bikes in this class.

If the bike has a lot of use or use in dusty/poor air filter the carb slide may not fit like it once did.

Funny you should say gave me the bike. There is a guy perhaps five miles from me who was given a ktm 500 of pretty much this vintage after the donating party got injured tow starting it. As far as I know it is still just a conversation piece and he hasn't injured his leg or anything else.

Fran

 

[stormer254]

On my big bore 2 strokes when cold I turn on petrol, ease over a few times to prime her, put on choke ease over tdc and then a firm kick. I do not touch the throttle, to make sure I don't, I hold onto the handle bar brace.
When hot ease over tdc and firm kick with a touch of throttle, however no big bore 2t is easy to start and a definite technique is needed which only practise can achieve

 

[suprize]

try retarding the timing a tad, that sometimes helps them fire up.

some guys here have it down pat and their five hunerts fire up 1st / 2nd kick hot and cold so its achievable.
how old is the fuel?? if its +6 months it may pay to freshen it up?

your not leaving the fuel tap on are you as this can leak and fill the crank with poo and require many turns at full throttle to clear it out before it will go.

my 400 does this and I have to kick it 10 +times on full throttle to lite it and fuel goes everywhere

so fresh fuel, new plug, turn fuel on, choke on, no throttle and kick as ol mate says above

if no go after 10+ kicks, pull the plug and check if its wet with fuel or dry.

if its wet, kick with full throttle, fuel off and no choke

if its dry, kick with choke and some throttle to draw some fuel in.

check your tap is not leaking and also id clean the carb out with compressed air if you haven't done so already. the pilot and or choke circuit may be blocked...

that should keep you busy!

 

[Michael Bucher]

Awesome responses guys...I will start trying all of the above. We just pull started again today, fired up fine, smoked like a banshee but then cleaned up. We wanted to hear how it sounds and see how it ran with the new silencer I installed. There's little spooge coming from pipe so gonna lower needle to lean out a bit. My neighbor and i have kicked it from above, side, left foot, right foot....nothing. I'm kicking it hard as hell and still nothing....we've cussed it when it kicks back like a bronco and bites us. I'm 6'2" - 230, my neighbor a little lighter...I'll keep you guys posted on progress. One last question, could most of the problems be related to the stator providing a weak spark? Appreciate all the help.
Mike

 

[silverstreakNZ]

the most important thing is getting it just past tdc and then kicking it all the way through so the engine turns over more than once . maybe do it by hand first and see how far the kick start actually has to go to get that 2nd rotation of the crank .

u start from tdc as this can give the most rotation to next tdc to build momentum in the crank etc

if you can picture this and achieve it will start like it should .

i can start my 82 500 with a worn out vm44 with my left foot . usualy have to lean the handle bars on the truck tho .

get a decompressor aswell . youll never regret it

 

[juicypips]

What state are the crank seals in?
If its been stood for a long time the old rubber ons
Can crack and stick themselves to the crank an rip the
Lip off, not seen it but heard it from my old man.
Could be worth a check

 

[jo360]

i need some new neighbours.

 

[juicypips]

jo360 you gotta ask yourself if they were doing it as a favor or out of spite?

 

[suprize]

that's it isn't ...the only bike I ever was given was a old Gemini 80 that had been set fire to!

who here even knows what a Gemini 80 is??? (psst thread hijack!!)

 

[juicypips]

I do and i would of set fire to it too

 

[troublemaker]

Don't you all remember that I went through all this with my 500?
Buy the digital ignition from electrex and the starting issues will be over,along with a decompressor valve.

http://www.cafehusky.com/threads/pvl-ignition-advice-500-lc.30878/

 

[suprize]

that smoking at start could be the cylinder is flooding so I would check the fuel tap and float levels. try turning fuel on for a short while then off before trying to start in case it is flooding. carb floats can lift the float level over time especially if it does a lot of miles in the back of a truck. this may be running fuel into the cylinder when the tap is on.

pull the big nut off the bottom of the carb with the fuel off and see if it still dribbles a bit. leaking fuel taps can be a nightmare...

 

[Michael Bucher]

Quick update: I've cleaned carb and tried all means of kicking this thing over....only thing that really works when cold is pull starting with another motorcycle. Once its hot, I can now kick over on second kick consistently. Once it was cold again, back to no-start condition. My assumption is that when the motor is cold, the cylinder and piston are creating a higher compression due to the contraction of the metals, thereby not allowing me to spin the flywheel fast enough to produce a good spark. I assume the opposite of a hot motor: expansion of metal is allowing slightly less compression thus allowing me to spin the flywheel faster producing a better spark. It does kick lighter when hot....this was checked by my calibrated leg. This bike runs great when its running. Barely smokes, very little spooge from pipe, seems to be very responsive while riding. Might be down to getting a new power dynamo ignition system. Any thoughts? Thanks for all of your help. Mike

 

[outdoorsman166]

I do and i would of set fire to it too

Hahaha

 

[suprize]

I would now make this observation as a mate has a moto villa 350 doing the exact same thing. We though the float level was high and kept lowering it but it wouldn't start. eventually I tipped the bike on its side and it started first kick!! the float level was too low! so try that and if it works, lift the float level a tad till you get a good result.

 

[Michael Bucher]

Update again: went riding this afternoon w my neighbor. Bike started second kick cold. Started three times on trails. Bump started down hill in 2nd...bike came raging to life doing a wheelie....that was fun. This bike is temperamental but seems to be getting more reliable everyday. I appreciate everyone's help....I'll keep ya posted.

 

[Michael Bucher]

Oh yeah forgot mention....I think the real starting problem might not be the bike at all....it might be the rider not "giving it hell" like my neighbor says.....time for the gym again....