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Hi everyone,
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Thanks for your patience and support!
KTM 350sxf: Thoughts after Hangtown
- Thread starter TXC&KTM
- Start date
robertaccio
Husqvarna
Pro Class
all the questions have been answered by Cairoli before the bike has seen ama mx action, especially after winning in the deep sand of valkenswaard at the Dutch round of the MXGP MX1.
as stated the bike would be a winner right out of the box, with everts driving the program it could not be anything but a winner. The bike actually even looked more settled/balanced around the track than the others. The other bikes look like they need more or new suspension tuning, especially reeds kxf, that thing looked brutal, but reed looks good and solid again. dungeys rmz looked completly out of sorts as well and appeared to have the full on rocking chair blues in the suspension dept, bouncing back and forth from front to rear and vice versa. the track looked pretty harsh on the riders.
as stated the bike would be a winner right out of the box, with everts driving the program it could not be anything but a winner. The bike actually even looked more settled/balanced around the track than the others. The other bikes look like they need more or new suspension tuning, especially reeds kxf, that thing looked brutal, but reed looks good and solid again. dungeys rmz looked completly out of sorts as well and appeared to have the full on rocking chair blues in the suspension dept, bouncing back and forth from front to rear and vice versa. the track looked pretty harsh on the riders.
I was very impressed with Alessi's second moto, and by rights he has been doing a heap of practice in motocross before the season so he should be very competitive from the start. His bike looked great, fast and flickable, Reed's bike looked terrible coming into the choppy braking bumps and he was taking a long time to pass others who he would normally smoke!
Lets hope the season stays close, Townley looks like he will be in the mix also!
Lets hope the season stays close, Townley looks like he will be in the mix also!
so heres the deal ....
reed got a good start the first moto and rolled to the win. two people say his bike looked bad. What would have happend if reed got a great start on the second moto?? what about if his bike was more settled and looked good. what about dungey on a superbly set up bike, instead of one bouncing all over. Did the 350 get it done because it is a superior bike or because most of the competition wasn't at the top of their game??
reed got a good start the first moto and rolled to the win. two people say his bike looked bad. What would have happend if reed got a great start on the second moto?? what about if his bike was more settled and looked good. what about dungey on a superbly set up bike, instead of one bouncing all over. Did the 350 get it done because it is a superior bike or because most of the competition wasn't at the top of their game??
Keeping in mind this was my 2nd pro race I've been to... so I know extremely little... but I thought many of the bikes had issues. When they chopped the throttle the was a bit too much backfiring from some of the bikes. When they opened the throttle there seemed to be hesitation on some of the bikes. I *assume* that is because the bikes were in a much higher state of tune i.e. finicky. High compression pistons, and other things.
Some of the bikes could have handled the terrain better too. But that was sort of the point to this thread - how did the 350 do. Looked good to me compared to the rest of the bikes. The Suzuki's also seemed to be set up ok.
I saw RCs last race at Hangtown with Stewart, this race did not seem to have the same level of intensity or preparation.
I did not get a chance to see the new Husqvarna 450 race.
Some of the bikes could have handled the terrain better too. But that was sort of the point to this thread - how did the 350 do. Looked good to me compared to the rest of the bikes. The Suzuki's also seemed to be set up ok.
I saw RCs last race at Hangtown with Stewart, this race did not seem to have the same level of intensity or preparation.
I did not get a chance to see the new Husqvarna 450 race.
TXC&KTM
Husqvarna
AA Class
robertaccio;98189 said:
This was my thought as well. It wasn't just that he got the hole shot on the second moto, it was how he left the turn and every other turn for that matter. The 450s just seemed sluggish leaving the corners. There were times Alessi seemed to effortlessly carve up the track.
How do you say "we need to build a
350 asap" in Japanese? 
Lap times between classes have always been close - nothing new there. In fact, I'm fairly sure in the days of 250 and 500 classes, in the last few years of the 500s the 250s were usually faster.
The 250 and 450 classes reflect what happened in the old classes, simple as that.
Having the 350 out there is a good thing, provided it doesn't lead to the BS idiocy of trying to dumb down the premier class and limit it to 350s. The premier class should be like it was in the 500 era - a variety of bikes, with each manufacturer trying their own idea of what would be the perfect solution. 500 world championships were won by 360s (well , in fact , the last 2t win in the 500s was the KTM, but I'm talking even earlier), 370s (I think most of the RN - or were the open classes RHs ?- Suzukis that won WCs were much nearer 400 than 500cc) 400s etc. Quite a few of the Maicos were 440s even when 490s were the production bike. CZs were usually 380cc. And sometimes a 500 4t 'Might" have been a 580.................. The Premier class should be the one that has the most demanding bikes to ride, as well as the option to use something less demanding.
Variety is want I want to see, as well as 2ts being allowed to compete on equal footing, 250s against 250s, then in the premier class, anything up to the maximum specified for the class. To see smaller capacity bikes, competing against bigger ( I'd love to see a full 500 4t, made ultra light, with 3 or 4 spds out there - that could be the perfect bike for just as many as a 350 or 450) ones, in both 2 and 4ts would be fantastic.
I really dread the thought of a 350 limit rearing it's ugly head again - for once the Japanese factories did the right thing when they told Lluongo to take a running jump when he / Youthstream proposed a 350 limit.
Can anyone explain to me how Searle's 250, which is supposedly homologated, is out there with a carb., when the production 011 KTM 250 will be EFI?????????????? Running a totally different type of induction doesn't seem to me to meet homologation / production rules. What about the 2010 Suzukis in the SX series, whilst other Suzuki runners had only 09s to use. I guess it's the same as the 350 Homologation for the nationals, they could be raced before you can buy them, so long as they are available by a set date?
The 250 and 450 classes reflect what happened in the old classes, simple as that.
Having the 350 out there is a good thing, provided it doesn't lead to the BS idiocy of trying to dumb down the premier class and limit it to 350s. The premier class should be like it was in the 500 era - a variety of bikes, with each manufacturer trying their own idea of what would be the perfect solution. 500 world championships were won by 360s (well , in fact , the last 2t win in the 500s was the KTM, but I'm talking even earlier), 370s (I think most of the RN - or were the open classes RHs ?- Suzukis that won WCs were much nearer 400 than 500cc) 400s etc. Quite a few of the Maicos were 440s even when 490s were the production bike. CZs were usually 380cc. And sometimes a 500 4t 'Might" have been a 580.................. The Premier class should be the one that has the most demanding bikes to ride, as well as the option to use something less demanding.
Variety is want I want to see, as well as 2ts being allowed to compete on equal footing, 250s against 250s, then in the premier class, anything up to the maximum specified for the class. To see smaller capacity bikes, competing against bigger ( I'd love to see a full 500 4t, made ultra light, with 3 or 4 spds out there - that could be the perfect bike for just as many as a 350 or 450) ones, in both 2 and 4ts would be fantastic.
I really dread the thought of a 350 limit rearing it's ugly head again - for once the Japanese factories did the right thing when they told Lluongo to take a running jump when he / Youthstream proposed a 350 limit.
Can anyone explain to me how Searle's 250, which is supposedly homologated, is out there with a carb., when the production 011 KTM 250 will be EFI?????????????? Running a totally different type of induction doesn't seem to me to meet homologation / production rules. What about the 2010 Suzukis in the SX series, whilst other Suzuki runners had only 09s to use. I guess it's the same as the 350 Homologation for the nationals, they could be raced before you can buy them, so long as they are available by a set date?
robertaccio
Husqvarna
Pro Class
reed got a good start the first moto and rolled to the win. two people say his bike looked bad. What would have happend if reed got a great start on the second moto?? what about if his bike was more settled and looked good. what about dungey on a superbly set up bike, instead of one bouncing all over. Did the 350 get it done because it is a superior bike or because most of the competition wasn't at the top of their game??
For me reed was the guy on the go his rides were amazing especially moto 2, his bike just looked like it was beating him up and was harsh (my non-pro view from the sidelines). As for the Kato it will continue to be a top runner but as the season continues I think we will see others get re-dialed in (dungey for example)and run with and beat the Alessi Kato combo, one thing that is well established is the Alessi hole shot ability, so lets see how that trend goes. Hangtown was tough and beat up, I think reed is still the guy to beat after round one, he showed his crafty/smart racing in the 2nd moto under tough conditions, reed is a good man and a smart racer (I just cant stand his dual diamond earing look!! ha ha ). Cant wait for another brand to break into the series. There are lots of contenders making for great racing! hey is JS7 coming back or what???
For me reed was the guy on the go his rides were amazing especially moto 2, his bike just looked like it was beating him up and was harsh (my non-pro view from the sidelines). As for the Kato it will continue to be a top runner but as the season continues I think we will see others get re-dialed in (dungey for example)and run with and beat the Alessi Kato combo, one thing that is well established is the Alessi hole shot ability, so lets see how that trend goes. Hangtown was tough and beat up, I think reed is still the guy to beat after round one, he showed his crafty/smart racing in the 2nd moto under tough conditions, reed is a good man and a smart racer (I just cant stand his dual diamond earing look!! ha ha ). Cant wait for another brand to break into the series. There are lots of contenders making for great racing! hey is JS7 coming back or what???
ray_ray
Mini-Sponsor
CR has kicked all these butts for years ....If not for RC and JS, he would be a legend ... But that is another 'what if' scenario that is meaningless ... But I was a little surprised to see him do so well after all the time off and on this bike that he was not raced much .... He probably knows when JS7 comes back, that his wins might be limited and he needs as big of a lead possible before js7 arrives ... Too 2 2 bad RV was not there 
What is interesting is the fact that so many top bikes were not set up very well for the track ... I guess us amateurs are not the only ones who can't tune a bike
... this just shows again that it is the rider, not the bike that wins the race ...
Good question here ...
And I'd like a add: Why run a carb when the new fangled efi is so great? .. lol ...
Coffee: I have only went to a few PRO outdoor races myself but within 3 seconds of watching them on the track, I said to my self: These guys are professionals!
What is interesting is the fact that so many top bikes were not set up very well for the track ... I guess us amateurs are not the only ones who can't tune a bike
... this just shows again that it is the rider, not the bike that wins the race ...Good question here ...
And I'd like a add: Why run a carb when the new fangled efi is so great? .. lol ...
Coffee: I have only went to a few PRO outdoor races myself but within 3 seconds of watching them on the track, I said to my self: These guys are professionals!
MXRider
Husqvarna
A Class
just an idea here, but certain bikes not performing 100% could be a sign of the times.
remember how big the factory involvement was 4-5 years ago?
now its all satellite teams with a few factory backed bikes.
back in the day the top 10-15 were all on full factory / works bikes with so much unobtainium it wasnt even funny.
personally I think it was just the riders were getting hammered toward the end of the race. MX is a brutal sport, and if your out of shape, it shows fast.
remember how big the factory involvement was 4-5 years ago?
now its all satellite teams with a few factory backed bikes.
back in the day the top 10-15 were all on full factory / works bikes with so much unobtainium it wasnt even funny.
personally I think it was just the riders were getting hammered toward the end of the race. MX is a brutal sport, and if your out of shape, it shows fast.
columbia510
Husqvarna
AA Class
Lets just have an OPEN class. 2-strokes,huge thumpers,little 250's or 350's for the elite fast guys and have the Lites class for the up kids comming up to the pro ranks. Just my 2cents.
"Mike’s bike came through tech inspection weighing 230 pounds, so it’s not really any lighter than the 450s (the class weight minimum is 220 pounds). Mike kept saying the bike is easier to ride because it’s lighter, but my guess is that it’s easier to ride because it has more controllable power delivery and less gyroscopic effect."
http://www.racerxonline.com/article/racer-x-redux-hangtown.aspx
http://www.racerxonline.com/article/racer-x-redux-hangtown.aspx
gestion01
Husqvarna
A Class
This could be a very good size engine for off-road. Ktm should get going with the 350xc asap...tons of guys waiting cash in hand to buy one. Much less in the mx line. A lot of mx buyers want the most hp, weather they can use it or not.
I tend to think mikes bike maybe bigger than a 350...what's keeping them from increasing the size a little on this engine and making us believe it's a 350?
I tend to think mikes bike maybe bigger than a 350...what's keeping them from increasing the size a little on this engine and making us believe it's a 350?