125-200cc 165 Clutch Drag

[freezerGeezer]

Hi All,

Having an issue with clutch drag, especially on long step descents when I have the clutch in & brakes on and I'm finding I have to keep the revs up to prevent stalling.

My oil is changed every 4-6 hrs and im running Motul 10-40 trans oil.
Basket has no grooves but I'm not sure on the age of the clutch so I have a new set of OEM fibres & steels ready to go in and a new clutch cable.

Before I get stuck in I have a few questions :

1. On the 125/165 is there any adjustment inside the clutch cover, have read about an adjuster screw but cant see it on my bike or in the manual?

2. Thinking of changing to ATF-F as people seem to have good results & I'm sick of paying £13 a litre for Motul, can anyone recommend what ATF to buy in the UK.

3. Is it worth drilling some extra holes in the inner clutch hub while I'm doing the work? Have read people have had good results on other makes.

4. Anyone with Zeta clutch lever/perch notice any difference between the two set-up options of the ? (mines currently set "Accurate Ratio")



Thanks in advance

 

[juicypips]

Is that cable or hyrdo clutch?
I wouldn't drill holes in the basket, I would pop the cover off and check for the adjuster on the basket.
But if there isn't one.... Sure there will be then I would look at warped friction disks.

From personal experience I've had clutch hub nut unwind on my kmx and a cable Frey and stretch.

 

[freezerGeezer]

Thanks Juicy.

It's a cable clutch
Just looked at pics from last time i opened her up for new kick start shaft, and I don't think there's an adjuster? i'm guessing it would be in the centre of the clutch if there was one?


Time for the new clutch plates & cable then!

 

[johnnyboy]

Looks to have a Mitika clutch basket fitted and they are pretty bullet proof, My 165 has always had atf and suffers no drag at all BUT I run a hydraulic Hymec type system with a 10.5 master cylinder that actually pulls the clutch arm a few millimeters further than the stock cable and starts in gear first kick with ease hot or cold. All the clutch plates I have tried the oem are the best but apico items release with the least lever travel and may help with the problem.
My hub has more holes drilled over stock and this may also help but wouldnt put money on it but has done no harm in hundreds of hours,

 

[justintendo]

Hi All,

Having an issue with clutch drag, especially on long step descents when I have the clutch in & brakes on and I'm finding I have to keep the revs up to prevent stalling.

My oil is changed every 4-6 hrs and im running Motul 10-40 trans oil.
Basket has no grooves but I'm not sure on the age of the clutch so I have a new set of OEM fibres & steels ready to go in and a new clutch cable.

Before I get stuck in I have a few questions :

1. On the 125/165 is there any adjustment inside the clutch cover, have read about an adjuster screw but cant see it on my bike or in the manual?

2. Thinking of changing to ATF-F as people seem to have good results & I'm sick of paying £13 a litre for Motul, can anyone recommend what ATF to buy in the UK.

3. Is it worth drilling some extra holes in the inner clutch hub while I'm doing the work? Have read people have had good results on other makes.

4. Anyone with Zeta clutch lever/perch notice any difference between the two set-up options of the ? (mines currently set "Accurate Ratio")
View attachment 81433View attachment 81434


Thanks in advance

i would say to keep the "accurate" position, as this is going to pull the cable further and get more complete clutch actuation compared to the "light" ratio..

 

[freezerGeezer]

Thanks for the help!

Think I'll put the plates in and fit a new cable and see from there.

Johnnyboy - what ATF are you buying here in the UK?

 

[johnnyboy]

Thanks for the help!

Think I'll put the plates in and fit a new cable and see from there.

Johnnyboy - what ATF are you buying here in the UK?

Comma semi synthetic - you can get it from Halfords and comes in a silver coloured container.

 

[freezerGeezer]

Ok so fitted the new OEM clutch fibres & steels although there didn't look to be anything wrong with the ones I removed.
Not sure what make the old ones are but was suprised to find the complete new pack is actually thinner than the old one.

New Old
Springs: 45.0 42.7
Fibres: 2.95 3.00
Steels: 1.38 1.44
Pack: 28.93 29.64

7 fibres, 6 steels (the OEM kit came with a spare steel?)

The old cable wasn't in great shape so I'm hoping that is the issue but when i tried to fit the new Venhill feather light cable I have I found out that the crimped metal piece at the end of the outer sheath that should slot into the lug on the side of the engine is to big?

Now searching for a replacement cable any advise on which one (in the U.K.)
so far I have a choice of OEM or Pro-X

Of course there is the option of drilling the lug out on the engine so I can use the Venhill cable but I'd rather not unless I have to.

 

[NCSteve]

If you have enough cable slack you can add a thin nut as a spacer between the cable nipple and lug.

 

[freezerGeezer]

Ok so modified the Venhill cable to fit and it has made a huge difference, I can now roll the bike in gear with the clutch pulled. (Still have to run with hardly any free play in the lever though).

Not sure I like the new clutch springs, even with the feather light cable the lever is much stiffer to pull, I didn't think much of it a first but after a 4hr enduro last wkd I was feeling it


Johnnyboy - Two different types of Comma semi synthetic ATF in Halfords, do you run the AQ3 or MVATF?

Thanks!

 

[jeanjean]

Hi freezerGeezer,

are you happy with the Zeta clutch perch ? I like the various adjustment possibilities.

Zeta says, the fulcrum of the lever is 25 mm in the light ratio and 27 mm in the accurate ratio. The OEM lever's fulcrum is 26 mm. So the difference is very tiny in either directions.

Do you have the 3 or the 4 finger lever? Which length does it have?

I find the OEM clutch lever to long, but like the OEM brake lever.

Regards,

jeanjean

 

[freezerGeezer]

Hi jeanjean,

I have the Pivot Perch CP with 3 finger lever.

I slide the clutch perch along the bars as away from the grip as possible but still found the 3 finger lever too long for me.
I ended up cutting the ball and a small piece of the lever blade off (probably 15-20mm in total) its now perfect, and no issues of fingers slipping off the lever yet!

All depends on whether you're used to 2, 3 or 4 fingers......... que the jokes
After years of mountain biking and 2 finger braking I found it very difficult to adapt to anything other than 2 fingers on the levers.

 

[jeanjean]

Same for me. I'm used to one to two fingers and I don't like to pinch the other when playing with the clutch.

Thanks for you feedback.

Is the Zeta 3 finger lever longer than the Brembo brake lever?

Sorry, bade question. Your lever is cut...

Regards,

jeanjean